Powerbuild 3 Level Rule

[muffinFBSL]

The damage output from this build is being severely under-estimated.

No, it isn't. I'm just trying to win an argument. kellendril's post about the issue doesn't make any sense. I was just telling him that. Yes, I know I have Bane of Enemies and Favored Enemy, of course those damage bonuses are not constant, I am fully aware of them. I'm the one making the build remember? Me not mentioning those bonuses is like propaganda in the same manner you posted about the Animal companion damage... uh LOL.

But seriously, I'm not underestimating anything. That's just insulting. I know exactly what I'm talking about, and the point is that it isn't a powerbuild. It is just a specified build that has a capability to do a lot of melee damage at the expense of many other combat abilities. However, that is not the point of this thread. Like nuthouse said, it is about the rule. Not my build. But whatever...

[kellendril]

Actually, he's right. I set my damage estimates at the minimum possible level, and only for 8 attacks per round. If you really look at it, the damage per round is FAR higher, and I was wrong to set the values where I did. I was on the right track, though. You really need to look at this whole thing and ask yourself why you want 12 attacks per round at such a low level (comparatively speaking, mind you). The answer is the obvious one, I believe, and the reason for the rule. You will be able to solo a ton of things based solely on the fact that you will deal out damage to them at a much higher rate than they will to you.

[nuthouse2k]

how many of his impressive 12 attacks would actually land at AB 32?

[kellendril]

how many of his impressive 12 attacks would actually land at AB 32?

They are not all 32 AB unless he is not taking any feats that add bonuses at all, which I doubt he is. I'm done with this discussion, it has become pointless. There is a rule in place, and it is there for a reason, and its already been said it is not changing. IF you can't see why a rule exists, maybe this is not the server for you. I am sure there are hack -n- slash servers out there that will let you build however you'd like.

[muffinFBSL]

You really need to look at this whole thing and ask yourself why you want 12 attacks per round at such a low level. The answer is the obvious one, I believe, and the reason for the rule. You will be able to solo a ton of things based solely on the fact that you will deal out damage to them at a much higher rate than they will to you.

That is absolutely false. 12 Attacks per round and +2 AB and 2d6 damage vs. Favored Enemies compared to 9 Attacks per round, where the missing 3 are made at -15,-20, and -25, and +1 AB on all attacks and +2 damage as well as Enhanced Power Attack. It is a perfectly even trade off.

Like I said, and I don't know how many times I can say it, the build is equally powerful either way and even on each individual level the power remains the same. Like I said a thousand times, I want to finish the Ranger because I want Bane of Enemies and PTWF because I've never had them before and think they're neat. Waiting until level 27 for no reason is stupid. I may not get to level 27 that way, I'd be so bored with the hunting. The rule is not to keep you from getting power earlier. In fact, that doesn't even apply to the Shadowdancer thing. The Shadowdancer is getting HiPS on level 13 or whatever no matter what. Not even the rule stops that, he just has to take more levels in it before 20 (also for no reason, he already has HiPS). For the thousandth time, the rule is meant to ensure that you get 3 levels in all your classes period. The reason it is set for before 20 is because level 30 used to take longer to get and there weren't many of them around. Now there's lots. That is the difference.

[muffinFBSL]

how many of his impressive 12 attacks would actually land at AB 32?

They are not all 32 AB unless he is not taking any feats that add bonuses at all, which I doubt he is. I'm done with this discussion, it has become pointless. There is a rule in place, and it is there for a reason, and its already been said it is not changing. IF you can't see why a rule exists, maybe this is not the server for you. I am sure there are hack -n- slash servers out there that will let you build however you'd like.

4 of them have the ultimate potential to be at 32, nuthouse. I can, pulling some strings, obtain a 37 AB while in IPA, getting 37/32 in both hands.

And you don't understand the rule. I'm not supposed to be kept from getting a level 21 Ranger Ability until level 27 because I want to multi-class. THAT MAKES NO SENSE. The only reason this discussion is pointless is because you think I'm powerbuilding, which is false.

[limited_resources]

Really, Muffin's build is a mute point. As Nutty mentioned earlier, we're talking about removing the rule itself here.

[nuthouse2k]

how many of his impressive 12 attacks would actually land at AB 32?

They are not all 32 AB unless he is not taking any feats that add bonuses at all, which I doubt he is. I'm done with this discussion, it has become pointless. There is a rule in place, and it is there for a reason, and its already been said it is not changing. IF you can't see why a rule exists, maybe this is not the server for you. I am sure there are hack -n- slash servers out there that will let you build however you'd like.

I am aware they are not all at 32... 5 is subtracted every time you make a new attack. so the attack sequence looks like this: 32/32 - 27/27 - 22/22 - 17/17 - 12/12 - 7/7

Thats really great. Add muffins 5 AB for whatever buffs he might have... Still not really that impressive is it? My question remains. How many of these attack would land on opponents that'd actually give you any noteworthy xp at the epic levels?

And please stop acting like a baby, because someone don't agree with you.
If you never question the system, what are you then? A mindless automaton?

For your information i actually DID change server partly because of the strict rules. It's funny why people like you can't get through your skulls, that it's actually possible to roleplay without really strict building rules.

Also funny how you say, that you're done with the discussion and then continue to offend me with your non-arguments and insults. It's pretty pathetic really.

[kellendril]

how many of his impressive 12 attacks would actually land at AB 32?

They are not all 32 AB unless he is not taking any feats that add bonuses at all, which I doubt he is. I'm done with this discussion, it has become pointless. There is a rule in place, and it is there for a reason, and its already been said it is not changing. IF you can't see why a rule exists, maybe this is not the server for you. I am sure there are hack -n- slash servers out there that will let you build however you'd like.

I am aware they are not all at 32... 5 is subtracted every time you make a new attack. so the attack sequence looks like this: 32/32 - 27/27 - 22/22 - 17/17 - 12/12 - 7/7

Thats really great. Add muffins 5 AB for whatever buffs he might have... Still not really that impressive is it? My question remains. How many of these attack would land on opponents that'd actually give you any noteworthy xp at the epic levels?

And please stop acting like a baby, because someone don't agree with you.
If you never question the system, what are you then? A mindless automaton?

For your information i actually DID change server partly because of the strict rules. It's funny why people like you can't get through your skulls, that it's actually possible to roleplay without really strict building rules.

Also funny how you say, that you're done with the discussion and then continue to offend me with your non-arguments and insults. It's pretty pathetic really.

Ok, for the sake of reality, please tell me where in ANY of this I insulted you. Thanks. Its really laughable that you call me a baby, then say I am insulting in the next breath without any real reason. Good for you.

[nuthouse2k]

Listen you pretentious cockroach...

I know exactly what you mean by :

I am sure there are hack -n- slash servers out there that will let you build however you'd like.

It means pack your things and go because you're not worthy of playing on a roleplaying server. We the hardcore roleplayers of this place are superior to you.

That's where you insulted me.

[ThatPirateGuy]

[Xanfyrst]

Really, forget Muffy's build. It's not important to the discussion.

Btw, cute roach. Can it fetch the newspaper too?

[mute83]

well, if it isnt a PB, and there is a valid RP, i would say there is a chance a DM will give it a "ok" stamp.
And if you remove the old, i think you will see some even more insane builds. Then the staff will have to give the mobs a boost, because some will complain that the mobs are now to weak, or just because people rib the mobs apart now, even easyer. So those that dont make the insane builds, are even more screwed. I think the rule is fine as it is. Just because one dosnt question it, dosnt mean you are an "autobot" or what ever shit you wrote, it means you agree with it

[nuthouse2k]

well, if it isnt a PB, and there is a valid RP, i would say there is a chance a DM will give it a "ok" stamp.
And if you remove the old, i think you will see some even more insane builds. Then the staff will have to give the mobs a boost, because some will complain that the mobs are now to weak, or just because people rib the mobs apart now, even easyer. So those that dont make the insane builds, are even more screwed. I think the rule is fine as it is. Just because one dosnt question it, dosnt mean you are an "autobot" or what ever (#2) you wrote, it means you agree with it

The reason Muffin made this thread was because he didn't wanna bother the DMs with a build AGAIN. The word was automaton.

[mute83]

yeah, auto bots is transformers.... "autobots. Ingage"

send me the build with the RP etc Muffin. Il bother them for you