Steadfast Determination?

[clean_slate]

I'm mainly interested in knowing is it worth it? On a melee build that is, but keep in mind that you have a wonderful Ring of The Knight ring which gives +2 to CON and DEX in addition to granting Toughness feat (which does not qualify you for SD as it is item granted). So with a class which doesn't get Toughness for free (like AK and FB) is it worth it to take 2 feats in order to have SD?

[Calodan]

Depends of if you have UMD or not really. I love the feat if you can spare feats. I usually couple it with Indomitable will as well. Is a solid feat and that 1 roll failure does happen more than you would like or even think. Most days they come in droves......

[mrieder79]

If you can fit it in there, it is very useful to have on a build that has high fortitude saves. If you do not have high fortitude saves it is less useful.

Here is the priority I place on my melee toon feats

Top priority:
AB and damage feats
Weapon focus feats
Weapon specialization feats
Melee weapon mastery feats
Able learner (for UMD and Tumble. I don't like builds without those)
Expose weakness

Second priority:
AC feats:
-LOH
-Two weapon defense
-Combat expertise
-Armor skin

Third Priority:
Utility feats:
Blindfight
Improved Crit
Steadfast
Epic stat increases

Obviously this isn't set in stone based on the type of build, but it is a general guideline.

[maseoo]

Does not Steadfast Determination (as a bug) also affect Will saves, meaning that if you roll a 1 on Will saves, you get a re-roll on them as well as on your Fort saves?
From what I recall that used to be the case before.
I try to take the feat on most chars that have a decent will and fort save, but that is in the UD, I don't know how common these rolls are in pve on the surface.

[Tsidkenu]

It's not a reroll, maseoo. If your total save still beats the DC, a roll of 1 is no longer auto-failure. And yes, an unfortunate bugged side effect is that will saves no longer auto-fail on a roll of 1 (but still assuming the total roll beats the DC).

[Thorsson]

The Will Save 'feature' is there whether you have Steadfast or not I believe.

If you have high Con and low Wis then Steadfast is also a handy boost to your Will Save. My rule is I take it almost always if I already have Toughness (e.g. AK, FB, or I'm a DD). Otherwise you need 2 Feats for it and it's not so attractive.

[TeoDeathDealer]

Given this bug, then is it even necessary to consider taking Epic Resilience?

[Tsidkenu]

Well Epic Resilience is the legit way to avoid auto-fails for Fort, Reflex and Will. It requires a 3 feat investment, though. Steadfast only gives avoidance for auto-fail on Fort, in addition to adding CON mod to will saves, and the bugged avoidance of auto-fail on said Will saves. So for a character with low WIS but high CON it is a great feat to pick.

And actually, now that I think about it, my drow bard does not have Steadfast but I have noticed on occasion rolls of 1 on her will save vs. Umberhulk confusion gaze but the effect does not happen. Other times it does. I don't know what bug that is, though.

[Bobthehero]

I have a character with 6 WIS and 18 CON, that feat gave me +6 to my will save, as well as the effect on fort saves, so yes, it was extremely needed on this guy.

[Karond]

my drow bard does not have Steadfast but I have noticed on occasion rolls of 1 on her will save vs. Umberhulk confusion gaze but the effect does not happen. Other times it does. I don't know what bug that is, though.

Game bug. You don't autofail will or reflex on a roll of 1. Only fortitude auto-fail when you roll that. Unless you've steadfast or the less appealing epic resilience feat.

[maseoo]

Thanks for clearing that up.

[Rudolph]

it is very useful to have on a build that has high fortitude saves

Resuscitating this topic for a question to veteran players: How high should those saves be exactly, do you think? What Fortitude score should be reached (via items, buffs, etc.) for Steadfast to be worthwhile?

I need to choose between Impr. Crit Longbow and Steadfast on an Assassin build. My WIS score is only 3 lower than CON, so that bonus doesn't mean much...

[Calodan]

it is very useful to have on a build that has high fortitude saves

Resuscitating this topic for a question to veteran players: How high should those saves be exactly, do you think? What Fortitude score should be reached (via items, buffs, etc.) for Steadfast to be worthwhile?

I need to choose between Impr. Crit Longbow and Steadfast on an Assassin build. My WIS score is only 3 lower than CON, so that bonus doesn't mean much...

Bow wielding assassin build? The Impr. Crit Longbow is far more useful to that specific build than steadfast.

[Hendrak]

Decent saves are mid 20ish. For Fort its better to aim for 30. those as vague aim +spells/buffs/spellcraft ranks

[Rudolph]

Bow wielding assassin build? The Impr. Crit Longbow is far more useful to that specific build than steadfast.

Mmmh. I could also take both and give up 1 AC (from Armor Skin).