Calling all rogue experts!

[grunts]

Hey so I've hardly played a rogue ever. I had a few questions for the rogue enthusiasts! Atm I'm leaning toward this melee hit and run build. It's got a lot of skill points for disable/OL/Search/UMD/etc.

http://nwn2db.com/build/?224074

Is there anything important I'm forgetting? I know it doesn't have epic dodge but I don't think it's that necessary since you get it at level 27 anyways. The build has neverwinter nine for the movement speed to successfully hit and run(hopefully).

What kind of Open Lock, Search and Disable Device do you need to succeed in epics? Do most people carry around both a stealth gear set and an ac/stats set? Is there some super dagger I should be looking out for? Any other advice?

Thanks a bunch!

Edit: Also what kind of effect does uncanny dodge have here?

[chad878262]

I'm no expert but I think the route you're going looks like you might benefit from adding invisible blade. Maybe R13/A9/IB5/bodyguard 3. You might also consider getting combat expertise, epic prowess and whatever the epic feat is that adds int to damage since assassin can cast fox's cunning. Extra sneak dice are great, but I would get epic dodge over 3d6 sneak dice, definitely.

[Blackman D]

open lock is way too high, most chests you will actually run into are DC 40 or less, 40 being a bit rare and you get take 20

you are going to want higher umd for scrolls you find

search and disable, max ranks is fine for disarming and finding about any trap, if you are trying to recover traps its a different story, ground epic traps get around 65 DC to recover

stealth gear of course, ac gear depends on if you really wanna bother with that, you are a hin with no str and things add up fairly quick if you carrying multiple sets of gear - but at the same note its either two sets of gear or a lot of UMD, you just cant do both because the weight will get to you and you wont be able to loot for long even if you have a +3 str item since you have it at 11

daggers, shop in gullykin, think they have some of the better ones

uncanny should be fixed and work as its suppose to

healing, kits weigh 10 lbs a stack so you will have to make sure you have some other way to heal, like a cure crit wand or something, but yea kits are not rogue friendly most the time

[Blackman D]

You might also consider getting combat expertise, epic prowess and whatever the epic feat is that adds int to damage since assassin can cast fox's cunning.

hes talkin about combat insight, however idk how much id value spending extra feats for it to only get +2 to +4 extra damage for a short duration

especially since you are not exactly building for death attack DC, if you are pushing like a +6 INT mod tho then it starts to look more worth it

but even then i would probably put points into bluff and pick up feint before i pick up CI, as being able to trigger sneaks without stealthing is more useful and doesnt cost an epic feat

[grunts]

Hey thanks for all the infos!

I never really cared for invisible blade since the bleed doesn't go through DR and if I want ac I shouldn't make a rogue to begin with. I also rather just run and restealth then stand there trying to feint while tanking. Or does it get around uncanny dodge?

Is the highest chest DC really only 40 here, even around dragons and such?

[Tsidkenu]

Only the locked doors in Netherese ruins require epic investment into Open Lock (DC 75+).

[AC81]

A hit and run melee build needs Epic Dodge imo. It's a great feat, you won't be disappointed.

[mrm3ntalist]

A hit and run melee build needs Epic Dodge imo. It's a great feat, you won't be disappointed.

^ This, because once you hit and then try to run, the mob will try to hit you at his highest AB. Epic dodge helps to avoid one hit till the hips timer resets.

[illithid]

I never really cared for invisible blade since the bleed doesn't go through DR

Invisible blade bleed damage does go through DR if you have the appropriate weapon equipped

[grunts]

Only the locked doors in Netherese ruins require epic investment into Open Lock (DC 75+).

Damn 75? So you have to max it and wear a bunch of open locks gear? Seems a bit excessive lol. The idea behind skipping epic dodge is usually killing what im fighting in the 19d6x5 opener. Pretty much nothing in jegs could live through it, though a lot of stuff on BG probably will eh? Especially sneak attack immune stuff.

With invisible blade are you talking about adamantite weapons? Didn't even know they existed here.

[Deathgrowl]

With invisible blade are you talking about adamantite weapons? Didn't even know they existed here.

Probably not. Cold iron and alchemical silver do, though, and there's more mobs with that kind of DR than /adamantine DR. There are a few mobs with /- DR, and that you just can't get through, but it's not that many.

[Blackman D]

highest netherese ruin lock is DC 99, its the extremely short cut thru the ruins to the other side, but this is not worth trying to do for any given build because it still basically takes two people and one needs to be a bard with +6 inspire competence

Invisible blade bleed damage does go through DR if you have the appropriate weapon equipped

low str builds are not going to carry multiple double sets of weapons, and even then the only spare set worth carrying is if you find ones with extrea melee blunt damage for undead

I also rather just run and restealth then stand there trying to feint while tanking. Or does it get around uncanny dodge?

feint forces flat foot, so yes

The idea behind skipping epic dodge is usually killing what im fighting in the 19d6x5 opener.

you only have 10 attacks and a 23 BAB, you will only have 4 sneaks in the first flurry, my hin is the same way but with less dice bc she is SD, also mobs on BG have a lot of hp most of the time and the issue with high SA dice is the average damage range is very wide

my assassin has 21d6 but only 2 attacks from stealth and there are mobs she still wont drop to half health and she can hit for 80-110 fairly easily, i would still imagine you would be able to drop some to badly wounded or near death tho

Probably not. Cold iron and alchemical silver do, though, and there's more mobs with that kind of DR than /adamantine DR. There are a few mobs with /- DR, and that you just can't get through, but it's not that many.

while true few have natural addy /- there are a good number of casters that use stoneskin and greater stoneskin that you will have to eat through, but good news is that feint often works on them if you have max bluff, its your saving throws you would have to worry more about

[DreWalker]

I found a dagger called pins greater not long ago

it has +3 ab
2d6 bonus feat: sneak attack
1d4 acid dmg

Im not sure how good these are for rogues as ive never made one myself but at least you have an idea as to what sort of weapons might drop

[ctothep]

EDIT: oops this was supposed to be a PM - my bad

sorry can someone delete?

[Blackman D]

I found a dagger called pins greater not long ago

it has +3 ab
2d6 bonus feat: sneak attack
1d4 acid dmg

Im not sure how good these are for rogues as ive never made one myself but at least you have an idea as to what sort of weapons might drop

pins is actually horrible for sneaks, its for non sneaks

the SA dice do not stack with the SA feat, so theoretically if you are an assassin it would be ok because their dice are DA