Questions about Loot

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ThelittleWiggle
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Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2012 5:14 pm

Questions about Loot

Unread post by ThelittleWiggle »

So, I see a lot of these threads in the AH area with items that seem very very good. +4 with multiple enchantments and what not. Now, I understand that the server has been up for some time, but realistically how many of these items are DM event rewards/grandfathered items? Is it just a circlejerk potato trade of these grandfathered items that people are only looking for trade?

To me it seems the economy in BG needs some help. Either you have a lot of gold, or you're scraping by on the absolutely awful and rare loot-bag drop or you have grandfathered items/dm event items and you can afford anything in the world.

My real question is if these items do drop (I'm pretty skeptical at this point) where do they drop? What determines the loot tables and are there different loot tables per area? I'm not complaining here. I've found some decent items and amassed a small fortune of my own, but I'm just curious where these insanely over powered items are coming from and if they are available equally to everybody...Or just a select few.
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NeOmega
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Re: Questions about Loot

Unread post by NeOmega »

it's survival of the fittest. This server has been up for, what, 8 years? The best items will be treasured and kept in the loop and in the game. The lesser items will be forgotten or sold. Every now and then someone dumps a load of stuff off at a shop that they don't want to hassle with selling. Especially things like SR items that can't be sold at auction.
NegInfinity
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Re: Questions about Loot

Unread post by NegInfinity »

ThelittleWiggle wrote: My real question is if these items do drop (I'm pretty skeptical at this point) where do they drop? What determines the loot tables and are there different loot tables per area? I'm not complaining here. I've found some decent items and amassed a small fortune of my own, but I'm just curious where these insanely over powered items are coming from and if they are available equally to everybody...Or just a select few.
//Since I obviously can't sleep today.

The loot table seems to be the same for all areas.
Higher levels players seem to be getting better drops.
An item from monster could drop pretty much anywhere, from any monster. I think I once found something very rare in cloakwood - back when it had lizardmen.

Economy right now is a mess, because pretty much the only reliable source of gold I see is farming of stuff like troll and wolf hides and quest gold rewards. Looting chests is not very reliable.

I believe there were restrictions on grandfathering certain very powerful items, and there was at least one occurrence where DM interfered and didn't allow an item to be traded due to it being grandfathered and powerful. It think it was +3 hid +3 move silently ring being sold in BG harbor. So if you see something fishy, you might want to report it.

Some of those "+4 +skill +skill +skill +extra damage +stun +something else" items in AH are unlike anything I encountered.
Karond
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Re: Questions about Loot

Unread post by Karond »

I've heard that chests are different, and I feel that's accurate too. They seem to be divided up into classes. Like the first two chests in the Frost Giant fortress are "epic chests" and have a decent chance to spawn good items, while the chests in his throne room or the one next to the dragon eggs are "normal chests" and at best will give you like 15 goldcoins or an empty ale stein.

Named items can probably drop everywhere though. When it comes to randomized items, that's probably also true, but there seems to be a massive percentage increase of finding decent things from the lootbags of bosses like the balor, black dragon, white dragon, wormthrax, pit fiend and dracolich. Maybe even the frost giant, but I've found or heard of someone find something great stuff on each of those bosses repeatedly but not the frost giant :P
Tsidkenu

Re: Questions about Loot

Unread post by Tsidkenu »

And the whole economic system will get a good shake up once item enchanting is fine tuned & implemented. Couldn't happen soon enough, really.
Nayriak
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Re: Questions about Loot

Unread post by Nayriak »

Tsidkenu wrote:And the whole economic system will get a good shake up once item enchanting is fine tuned & implemented. Couldn't happen soon enough, really.
I just hope its a collaberative effort needed for anything significant. I.e. to mine ore and refine it would be easiest with a strong str attribute, to refine hides into leathers and wood into staves/bows would be easier for a high dex attribute, to refine gems needed for enchanting maybe a high intel and/or cha attribute with the enchanting itself only a spellcaster can accomplish.

Something like that which involves teamwork
chad878262
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Re: Questions about Loot

Unread post by chad878262 »

Nayriak wrote:I just hope its a collaberative effort needed for anything significant. I.e. to mine ore and refine it would be easiest with a strong str attribute, to refine hides into leathers and wood into staves/bows would be easier for a high dex attribute, to refine gems needed for enchanting maybe a high intel and/or cha attribute with the enchanting itself only a spellcaster can accomplish.

Something like that which involves teamwork
While it's currently not finalized I don't believe something as complex as what you've written out is feasible seeing as we want to get it in sooner rather than later. I proposed using rare gems for enchantment, so finding those would become more important, but currently it really is just a caster with the appropriate feats and spells.

Regards to the OP, as I recall when mrieder79 was working on the party loot chests he also wanted to look at the loot tables and there were chest levels 1-5 with chest level 5 having the highest percentage for a better drop. The Loot tables and RIG both need to be looked at and potentially modified, but as I have stated in other threads, changing too much, too fast could be detrimental to the end result we are looking for. So we have 1 epic shop, with more to follow based on the impact. Next (hopefully soon) we get enchanting, then we examine the impact... Later, perhaps we update the RIG / Loot tables, but it depends on the impact we have from the other changes. This way we will hopefully reduce the risk of any detrimental server impacts to avoid power creep causing the server to lose it's challenge.
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ThelittleWiggle
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Re: Questions about Loot

Unread post by ThelittleWiggle »

Tsidkenu wrote:And the whole economic system will get a good shake up once item enchanting is fine tuned & implemented. Couldn't happen soon enough, really.
plz hurry
Nicholaius - Astronomer of Selune
NegInfinity
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Re: Questions about Loot

Unread post by NegInfinity »

Nayriak wrote:
Tsidkenu wrote:And the whole economic system will get a good shake up once item enchanting is fine tuned & implemented. Couldn't happen soon enough, really.
I just hope its a collaberative effort needed for anything significant. I.e. to mine ore and refine it would be easiest with a strong str attribute, to refine hides into leathers and wood into staves/bows would be easier for a high dex attribute, to refine gems needed for enchanting maybe a high intel and/or cha attribute with the enchanting itself only a spellcaster can accomplish.

Something like that which involves teamwork
Ugh. I absolutely hate those kind of crafting chains in games. Arbitrary mining spot in arbitrary location requiring arbitrary skilll check.

At least stick with pnp skills for that. Also, keep in mind that in PnP it is only possible to craft a mundane or masterwork items (meaning arms/armor) and only masterwork items can be enchanted.

I also hope that crafting system will allow warlock crafters/enchanters (it is a natural fit for the clas). Because judging by what I saw in pieces of information, it looked like warlocks were gonna be left out.
NeOmega
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Re: Questions about Loot

Unread post by NeOmega »

I just hope it is far more expensive to craft an epic weapon than it is to buy one at a shop. After all, these will be customized dream weapons with epic everything. Nobody will really build anything else. And it will probably be the end of the random loot generator, which I think people don't give enough credit for being one of the best things on this server.

And I Can tell you for a fact, higher CR areas give better loot. I have never found an epic item from a low level boss drop. I have in some of the chests that have no level limit, such as the one at the end of the gnolls, and the one at the end of the goblin ruins.
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sweetlikesplenda
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Re: Questions about Loot

Unread post by sweetlikesplenda »

NeOmega wrote:I just hope it is far more expensive to craft an epic weapon than it is to buy one at a shop. After all, these will be customized dream weapons with epic everything.
I have to agree with this.

I played on a NWN1 server that allowed crafting and rewarded dedicated crafting PCs that RPd the whole thing, rather than just *poof* here is your uber weapon. They gave the approved crafters tokens that allowed them to add properties to the item. The tokens were limited, per time they were given out (I think quarterly), and each property required a certain number of tokens. So, the crafter was not just out on the side of the road hawking epic gear like they were fruit merchants. It required the crafter to consider what they could/would do for someone or themselves and what they charged for it.

Now, I'm sure someone will comment that this would lead to favoritism, but since this is being opened up to the community at large, from my understanding, the token system or some other system to restrict what can be added and the level it can be added at, could be applied to everyone I'm sure.

I understand there is a cry on the forums lately that we need to have uber gear available to everyone, but where does that end? If literally everyone has uber gear then no one has uber gear. Just like in life, there has to be strong people who can go out and aquire things and people who are rich and can afford things other people can't. I mean, I wish I had 10 mil gold, like some have (Never had more than 400k and he gave half of that to further RP in the story arc), I'd love to just find and have so many epic items that I can trade them away at will and not have a care. But, this isn't reality. I mean, if we are going to just give access to uber stuff to everyone, if they just go out and grind a little for gold (There are far too many threads about how easy it is to get gold and how gold is this side of worthless), then we may as well just start everyone off at lvl 30 and hand out the epic gear at character creation.
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NegInfinity
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Re: Questions about Loot

Unread post by NegInfinity »

NeOmega wrote:I just hope it is far more expensive to craft an epic weapon than it is to buy one at a shop. After all, these will be customized dream weapons with epic everything. Nobody will really build anything else. And it will probably be the end of the random loot generator, which I think people don't give enough credit for being one of the best things on this server.

And I Can tell you for a fact, higher CR areas give better loot. I have never found an epic item from a low level boss drop. I have in some of the chests that have no level limit, such as the one at the end of the gnolls, and the one at the end of the goblin ruins.
Well, in PnP enchanting had XP cost. So you guys could add that.

In the past I submitted a quick test crafting module to Rasael, where you had to buy materials, and craft for several days with a chance of screwup. (Crafting Masterwork Mithral fullplate will take forever). As far as I can tell, that was shelved and won't be used.

IIRC in PnP crafting wondrous item took time - 1 day per 1000gp gold cost of the item.

There are plenty of ways to go about it...
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