Shield Bash

[ARHicks00]

Other than only getting one attack, there other things I notice about Shield bash.

- Shield Bash ignores reflective attacks like Death Armor allow a person to do damage without receiving damage in return.

- Shield wielders do not get a left handed enchanted bonus for attack/damage with an enchanted shield. The same magic used to give weapons more damage/accuracy is the same magic that makes a shield sturdy. A shield after all is blunt damage and is no different from a blunt weapon like mace or Warhammer. Even if you argued against the idea that enchanting only means more defense, wouldn't magic weapon and greater magic weapon spells as well as other enchanting weapon spells have an affect on the shield if you get Shield Bash?

- If the extra attack per attack with a shield is never implemented, how about adding an extra dice roll for every benchmark a player reaches on their BAB. (BAB 6, 11, 16, 21, 26) So a player with BAB of 11 using a heavy shield should get 2d4 damage per round.

- Shield Bash tends to interrupt attack animations as the bash is used at random. The main weapon attack and damage roll still go through, but almost appears as if you cancelled the attack at the last minute.

- I could be wrong as I haven't used the DM guide in a while, but isn't the shield bash feat suppose to remove 2 AC when using it until improve Shield Bash.

- If you have shield bash on while setting off a trap, the character auto bashing the container until it is turned off. Even if you turn it off then turn it back on, the character will continue to attack the container that had a trap on it.

- The words *Sneak Attack* can be seen when bashing a container using shield bash.

- I could be wrong, but I don't think shield bash uses strength roll when an attack is landed. I also believe other damage sources are also not included or use when attacking. Can someone confirm this?

That's all I have really noticed about the Shield Bash.

[chad878262]

This is still in discussion in QC, but I can answer a couple of your questions/concerns:

- If the extra attack per attack with a shield is never implemented, how about adding an extra dice roll for every benchmark a player reaches on their BAB. (BAB 6, 11, 16, 21, 26) So a player with BAB of 11 using a heavy shield should get 2d4 damage per round.

The feat will recognize TWF / ITWF and GTWF and give an extra die of damage up to the third feat (it will not give more for perfect two weapon fighting though.

- I could be wrong as I haven't used the DM guide in a while, but isn't the shield bash feat suppose to remove 2 AC when using it until improve Shield Bash.

Not implemented on BGtSCC. We don't have Improved Shield Bash and the feat is not OP so no reason to nerf it IMO.


I will link your findings to the topic in QC so they can be reviewed further.

[Theodore01]

The feat will recognize TWF / ITWF and GTWF and give an extra die of damage up to the third feat (it will not give more for perfect two weapon fighting though.

Where does this come from? I've never heard of this and i play a shield basher.
Using high dex feats are not really a good option, as you need high STR to do any damage with a shield.

Not implemented on BGtSCC. We don't have Improved Shield Bash and the feat is not OP so no reason to nerf it IMO.

These is a Tower with Improved Shield Bash in the Hellstore - no idea what it does.

[chad878262]

Where does this come from? I've never heard of this and i play a shield basher.
Using high dex feats are not really a good option, as you need high STR to do any damage with a shield

I agree, but I'm not necessarily stating how it will work, but how it currently should work. I haven't tested it, but one of the developers commented on it in QC when we were discussing potential changes.

These is a Tower with Improved Shield Bash in the Hellstore - no idea what it does.

I don't recall the feat ever being discussed or implemented so my guess would be that it does nothing.

[Sun Wukong]

Does Shield Slam allow you to do sneak attacks still?

[chad878262]

Does Shield Slam allow you to do sneak attacks still?

Did it ever? It says the target of your shield bash has to save or be dazed. Dazed creatures are not flat footed and, thus would not be subject to sneak attacks (at least, bladeweave doesn't make them subject to sneak attacks).

[Theodore01]

Sure it does
At least yesterday it did.

[chad878262]

Sure it does
At least yesterday it did.

So does it stun as opposed to daze? Daze doesn't make the opponent flat footed, but the description in the feats states when hit by shield bash it's a save vs. daze effect.

More stuff to test, I suppose.

[Theodore01]

- If the extra attack per attack with a shield is never implemented, how about adding an extra dice roll for every benchmark a player reaches on their BAB. (BAB 6, 11, 16, 21, 26) So a player with BAB of 11 using a heavy shield should get 2d4 damage per round.

What about that ? How is this possible ?

A perfectly viable preepic paladin build is a pure paladin with the Cavalier kit. I rcred my EDM paladin for a cavalier and it is so fun to play, with many tricks. CHA should be as low as possible and the rest should go on STR. I picked CE, ICE and Tower Shield. Knockdown and Improved knockdown combined with the shield slam granted by the cavalier is a lethal combination.
The AC should be 50+ even pre epic, while the damage is better than the EDM variants preepic becasue of higher STR, shield bash ( +3 attacks with 15ish damage ) and Favored Enemies - you can get up to +5damage for enemies in your list of FEs.
It performs very well and i imagine the Shield DCs will be very efficient even pre epic. You should try it.

Wait , does shield bash trigger now more than once a round ?
Was that changed, the feat description was always wrong about these additional attacks.

It does for me. Once on each flurry

And here are more things to consider regarding Sbash
viewtopic.php?f=64&t=55607&hilit=shield+bash

[ARHicks00]

Still, enchants not having an affect on the left arm makes the shield useless. It also does not get strength bonus nor magic bonus for spells like Divine Favor. Shield bash also does not get bonus for the enchants put on the Shields.

[Klompoen]

Are other enchantments on attacks supposed to work with Shield bash? like divine favour, bard inspirations, flame weapon, etc.?

will this be put into the game at any time?

[Calantyr]

I'm confused. Would a Ranger with their two-weapon feats gain multiple attacks per round with shield bash? I asked about this ages ago and was told no.

[K'yon Oblodra]

I'm confused. Would a Ranger with their two-weapon feats gain multiple attacks per round with shield bash? I asked about this ages ago and was told no.

From what I understood currently it does nothing for you to have improved or greater two-weapon fighting.
However they are thinking about adding extra damage dice for these feats. Correct me if I misunderstood Chad.
There is supposed to be one shield bash per flurry from what I read in the quote of mmm.

When you daze an opponent with your slam he is thrown off-balance, essentialy being flatfooted. Such an opponent is susceptible to sneak attacks and cannot perform any actions. This includes not being able to drink potions. This is unlike the normal daze effect that spells for example use which seems to protect against sneak attacks and allows dazed creature to drink potions. Daze Immunity does not prevent the Shield Slam daze.

This explains the sneak attack part.