Daggerspell mage daggers?

[MrCravon]

Daggerspell mage is a fun and quite powerful class to play. Adding sneak and dagger damage to touch spells is very cool and really fun. I recently leveled a daggerspell mage/wizard/rouge and have now reached lvl 9 in the daggerspell mage class. One of the things I was really looking forward to was the implied diversity when it came to adding thrown daggers to my ranged touch attack spells. I thought it would be incredibly cool to add a daggers abilities like 1d4 Acid and On hit: Ability drain STR (DC=14) to a Lesser Orb of Fire spell. And maybe change it up with multiple sets of daggers for different situations. It was a bit disappointing that it didn't work like that. Of course the Daggercast feat description reads "adding the base dagger damage plus any enhance bonus from each dagger" so it was silly of me to expect it to work like I described above.

I do still wonder though, WHY it works like it does now?

"a daggerspell mage can imbue arcane spell power into his thrown daggers. The mage can deliver a ranged touch attack spell with one of his daggers, adding it's damage to that of the spell"

Doesn't it make more sense that all the daggers abilities would be included when it is the actual daggers that hit the target? I realize this would make an already powerful class slightly more powerful. But I really think it would add a lot of cool diversity to the class. Is it a limitation in the game engine that makes it the way it is handled today?

My idea was to play a character who where obsessively interested in acquiring unique and powerful daggers. And that his spell-casting revolved around this obsession. But now I find the dagger collection a bit useless as only the enhancement bonus really makes a marginal difference.


I am sorry if his has been talked about before, I used the search function and found nothing about it. Also, I really dont mean to come off as being negative, this is purely ment as constructive criticism. Thanks for reading! Leave your opinions below.

[Egg Shen]

That's a cool idea re: the collecting of unique daggers that each shine in a different scenario. I don't think it would be overpowered to add this bit, although I suspect it might be difficult from a scripting/coding standpoint.

So, in the class combo you mentioned above, you're getting your sneak damage added to your melee/ranged touch attacks? I guess I always thought you'd still have to take arcane trickster to pull this off. If Daggerspell Mage automatically gets his sneak damage on touch attack spells, I'm suddenly very interested in the class.

I'm imagining lots of avasculating and enervating. Would the bleed damage from Invisible Blade be added, too? Oh man, I hope it is...
*Edit* Does it trigger a death attack via Assassin? If so, I'm apparently going to have to create yet another character.

[freekender]

In fact it would make a lot of sense that ALL the properties of the dagger would be added to a ranged touch attack a DsM makes, not only the 1d4+EB.

- Arcane Throw: At 4th level and higher, a daggerspell mage can imbue arcane spell power into his thrown daggers. The mage can deliver a ranged touch attack spell with one of his daggers, adding it's damage to that of the spell (adding the base dagger damage plus any enhance bonus from the right hand). The dagger returns to the mage automatically.
At 8th level, a dagger spell mage adds his/her left hand dagger to ranged touch attack spell damage as well. This adds your base dagger damage plus any enhance bonus from each dagger to ranged touch attack spells.

According with the description I asume the idea is that the DsM throws the dagger(s) when (s)he delivers the RTA. So, if the RTA hits, so does the dagger(s). Why should it not deal the full damage and oh-hit properties?

[Valefort]

I'll see what I can do, it's not necessarily easy though.

[MrCravon]

I'll see what I can do, it's not necessarily easy though.

That is all I can ask, really appreciate the effort! Thank you very much! *is excited*

[freekender]

I'll see what I can do, it's not necessarily easy though.

Wow. That was an incredibly quick answer. Thank you Valefort!

[Juramenta]

I'll see what I can do, it's not necessarily easy though.

That would be amazing!

[Valefort]

Can you guys give me a list of all the on hit properties you've ever found on daggers ? There shouldn't be too many hopefully.

[Sun Wukong]

Daze, sleep, and various poisons. Just shooting off from my memory. Do you need to know the exact poison types and DCs?

(And while we are at it, how about removing daggerspell mage alignment restrictions, since it is pretty much the only real PRC for Warlocks?)

[Valefort]

Thing is I have to convert the onhitproperties into effects before blending them in the RTA spells effects and there's no magical function to do this (as far as I know). So what is left to do is writing all the effects corresponding to each on hit property that is available on the server for daggers, which is doable because there are not that many as far as I know.

So yes I need all of them on hit properties in as much details as possible, otherwise I might miss something.

[dzidek1983]

I think you need all on hit properties from weapons cos you never know what the random loot generator will create. Furthermore you can have Daze wit 14 DC and 18 DC and other combinations. Do you need just the effect or with the DC?

[Valefort]

It will be limited to what is known as I won't recreate every possible onhit property, there are too many and most can't happen on the server. As for the various DCs yes, tell if you can ! I'll make my own search on the blueprints but it's easy to miss things.

[dzidek1983]

Cant you just filter the shop inventory list for daggers? From the player side its hard to visit every shop on the server.

[chad878262]

Wait a minute, aren't those on hit properties supposed to fire like 10-50% of the time? If that becomes 100% I don't think we want to do it.

Alignment restriction removal I agree with, but I think would require dm approval to implement.

[Juramenta]

What about only damage increase?
So normal spell buffs cast on weapons. Would that be easier to implement?