Divine Champion bonus feats

[dedude]

Is there any reason a DC can only pick Great Wisdom as an epic bonus feat? Considering most their abilities are CHA based, at least Great Charisma seems to jell more with the class?

[Calodan]

That is one of my issues as well with it. Can we get the EPIC Feats to at least take normal EPIC feats? Like add in the bonus to all base stats at least?

[Valefort]

That would be a very big buff, updating the list a bit with some of the custom feats might be a good thing though.

[Calodan]

That would be a very big buff, updating the list a bit with some of the custom feats might be a good thing though.

Well maybe not the whole FIGHTER FEAT LIST. Just the base stats and some bonus feats? PLEASE VALE? YOU ARE THE BESTEST BEST! I will have Chad buy you dinner!

[dedude]

Well maybe not the whole FIGHTER FEAT LIST. Just the base stats and some bonus feats? PLEASE VALE? YOU ARE THE BESTEST BEST! I will have Chad buy you dinner!

I know he can't resist that offer!

[Valefort]

He did it already

Either way base stats are the big deal here so probably not ! You can have up to 4 bonus epic feats, that would be a bit much.

[Sun Wukong]

Either way base stats are the big deal here so probably not ! You can have up to 4 bonus epic feats, that would be a bit much.

Which would be twice as much what Anointed Knights and what not get.

I think this is true enough for the stock NWN2 Divine Chamption: At 2nd level, the divine champion may select a bonus feat from the following list:

• Blind Fight = Second chance to hit unseen enemy.
  Combat Expertise = -3 to attack rolls transfers to +3 to AC.
  Dodge = +1 AC Bonus.
  Extra Turning = Turn Undead.
  Improved Combat Expertise = +6 to AC transfers to -6 to attack rolls.
  Improved Critical (any) = Doubles the Critical Hit Probability.
  Improved Initiative = +4 initiative checks.
  Improved Parry = Increased chance to counter attacks.
  Weapon Focus (any) = +1 AB to one weapon.
  Weapon Proficiency (exotic) = Allows to use Exotic Weapons.

If the bonus feat falls on an epic character level, the following feats are available in addition to the list above:

• Armor Skin = +1 natural armor AC.
  Automatic: Quicken Spell = quick cast on low level spell.
  Automatic: Silent Spell = allows to cast lesser spells when silenced.
  Automatic: Still Spell = Remove somatic failure on lesser spells.
  Epic Damage Reduction = 3/- (can be taken 3 times, making a 9/- damage reduction).
  Epic Prowess = +1 to All attacks.
  Epic Spell Focus = non-stacking +6? DC save spell.
  Epic Spell Penetration = +6 on caster level checks.
  Epic Toughness = Hit points +30 stackable.
  Epic Weapon Focus (any) = +2 attack on a specific weapon. (stackable)
  Epic Weapon Specialization (any) = +6 to Damage to chosen weapon.
  Great Smiting = 2x smite damage stackable to 10x.
  Great Wisdom = +1 Wisdom up to +10.
  Improved Stunning Fist = +2 Stunning fist DC up to +20.
  Overwhelming Critical (any) = adds critical damage.
  Planar Turning = Turn outsider creature.

I suppose Divine Champion would be pretty decent for a Zen Archery based non-casting build of some kind.


So yeah, the custom Combat modes would be a nice additions on that list.

[dedude]

Either way base stats are the big deal here so probably not ! You can have up to 4 bonus epic feats, that would be a bit much.

If not all, how about just great charisma? All the DC feats are CHA based. Or is there some combination there that would put it over the top? Blackguard+DC with divine might?

[Calodan]

He did it already

Either way base stats are the big deal here so probably not ! You can have up to 4 bonus epic feats, that would be a bit much.

Okay fine then.....Not like it has a spell casting progression or anything but alas I have failed. Just thought that maybe a bit more relaxed stance on that might encourage some other builds that are not FIGHTERS. One of the big reasons so many builds do not use a PRC like this is that well the feats suck and Fighter is better allowing for AB and EB bonuses on Feats through the weapon specialization feats which only fighter qualifies for. At least if say STR at least were connected to the bonus feats for something like DC where we could pump the STR stat a bit more and get some EB that way.....but I can only suggest what I think is neat and want you all do the work with the DMs to come up with a good way to do this thing. Thanks Vale. What if we just allowed STR? WIS and STR those are DC things right? Don't make me resort to empty threats Vale...I will if I have too.....

Out of curiosity what bonus feats would be added if you did? Like what is not connected? Shield feats and the like? Charge feats? The new fangled Action feats like Northlander and such?

[Sun Wukong]

Out of curiosity what bonus feats would be added if you did? Like what is not connected? Shield feats and the like? Charge feats? The new fangled Action feats like Northlander and such?

Just add all of them. Make Divine Champions great again!

[Theodore01]

Don't forget the combat-focus line.

[Calodan]

I think the biggest concern is the use of DC in Epics but I fail to see how that is different than that of Fighter in Epics? I mean should we limit Fighter instead? Is the problem that Fighter is too OP? I am of course not serious and I respect all that QC and the DMs do. I just do not see what the issue is at all. The class is not a power house class and requires investment into lore skills that not many classes have in the first place.

Specifically any class that is melee oriented so Lore Religion is a bit of a odd ball to even take the class. Those that have Lore Religion are casters and do not generally take it because well Dispel fix and DC has no spell progression. It is pretty much a Melee class that requires you to invest skill points that are cross classed or you use a feat to not take the hit of an extra skill point to get the Lore you need to take it.

The one thing DC gives that fighter does not is +5 to ALL SAVES at level 10 but it can not qual for the Weapon Specializations either. So it seems pretty tit for tat there. Why not allow the feats the same way? What does this make? What specific style of builds are the QC and DMs worried about that would be too OP for Melee at this point?

I simply must know! Just saying it is OP is one thing but what is doing that in your mind? What builds? I am not trying to be a pain but if we as players are to understand how to suggest things then we need to understand what you are thinking. The people who run this thing!

[chad878262]

I would be ok with adding the non-epic custom feats to DC list, such as Heavy Armor Optimization, Shield Specialization, Shield Slam, etc... However, I would not be ok adding Great STR/Great CHA to the list. You could end up with an insanely good EDM/Divine Smiter with 21 STR (+3 belt from hell) and something like 26 CHA (+4 from eagle splendor potion when you want to smite or get 20 rounds of 20 damage/hit from EDM...OR BOTH!)

Adding the bonus feats IMO would be a good change, because honestly when I build I always have a hard time fitting in most of them because most of them simply are not as good as most vanilla feats, except for specific builds/concepts. I don't think DC being able to take those feats would be much of a power boost, but adding more epic feats to the list would be a very big boost.

[Calodan]

I would be ok with adding the non-epic custom feats to DC list, such as Heavy Armor Optimization, Shield Specialization, Shield Slam, etc... However, I would not be ok adding Great STR/Great CHA to the list. You could end up with an insanely good EDM/Divine Smiter with 21 STR (+3 belt from hell) and something like 26 CHA (+4 from eagle splendor potion when you want to smite or get 20 rounds of 20 damage/hit from EDM...OR BOTH!)

Adding the bonus feats IMO would be a good change, because honestly when I build I always have a hard time fitting in most of them because most of them simply are not as good as most vanilla feats, except for specific builds/concepts. I don't think DC being able to take those feats would be much of a power boost, but adding more epic feats to the list would be a very big boost.

I knew it was some shit about a EDM Smiter that was stopping this.....I am so tired of this. Not your fault Chad. Just my own soap box really. Oh wellz. Go figure.

[chad878262]

We did improve upon the level 5 DC Feat Divine Wrath recently, making it quite a nice feat, especially if you have some Charisma. It is on a cooldown now and the duration is increased so it can be up to 10 rounds. Making Divine Champions who are not EDM'ers have a neat little damage option they can use every 5 minutes.