Best alchemists = merchants?

[Mork]

Let me start with information that I do not play an alchemist and never tried brewing potions so I can be wrong here.
I know that it costs gold. My question is - are there any changes to alchemy in future plans?
Current situation is - plain and simple best alchemist is not someone who wasted a feat and got alchemy skill. Best current alchemists seem to be merchants with + appraise gear.

I mean - at the moment it is like a lot cheaper to buy potions from high appraise chars that get them from NPC-Vendors than it is to buy them from actual PC alchemists that make them.

I'd expect that no matter how high someone appraise is alchemists should always be able to craft potions cheaper while it far from true on our server.

My question - is it oversight and we can expect that in future it will be changed to what logic suggests it should be?
I'd suggest something like:
Potion X - to 50 appraise char vendor sells it for 1000 coin
Potion X - price for crafting with 50 alchemy char that took a feat 500 coin

Considering we'll make alchemy gear availability comparable to appraise one.

[chad878262]

We will not be lowering the cost further at this time. We just lowered it from base 50 gp down to 30, which can be further reduced to 20 with Master Alchemist alongside reducing the base for scrolls from 25 gp down to 15. Any further reduction would need to include Wands as they are also base 15gp per use (750gp / 50 uses).

While SOME potions are available cheaper from vendors, not all are and, aside from a few exceptions such as heal and greater heroism, potions only come for spell of level 3 or lower. Master Alchemist can brew you a potion of up to spell level 7, such as energy immunity or Shadow Shield. Finally, the Master Alchemist in many cases can make a potion which is not subject to Greater Dispel (so long as they have CL30), albeit at a higher cost, if you are planning on a long dungeon run, DM event or otherwise it might be worth the higher gold amount. With Master Alchemist a character with no UMD can now get full buffs, though I imagine it will take a bit of time before folks are comfortable enough to avoid building UMD in to every build on the server, it will take place eventually.

This is coming from one of the 3 or 4 primary advocates for lowering the costs as was recently done... I believe Master Alchemist and wand/scroll/potion crafting is in a good place right now. They can offer enough things that can't be purchased from NPC vendors to be useful while still leaving those who play in a slow timezone the ability to acquire some of the most popular potions at a discounted cost. Any further tinkering would require a major overhaul looking at all the various vendor consumables sold.

Finally, while gold has far more value now with epic shops and more long term consumables available, it is also far easier to acquire gold than it was before the changes went in to increase the chance of something good in the loot tables. While Epics are still rare (as they should be) a smart looter that establishes one of the many decent runs can earn gold at an extremely fast rate, especially if they purchase and use those consumables available until they can acquire top end gear. Spend ~1,000 gold pieces on consumables for an hour loot run and even mid-level PC's can make an average of around 30K in that hour, EASY... It is very possible to get one lucky item and clear six figures.

[Mork]

My suggestion does not necessary say anything about lowering prices for crafted potions. I'd consider increasing price of some potions in vendor stores or lowering bonuses appraise gives to buying those specific items - just to make alchemists more viable.

While SOME potions are available cheaper from vendors, not all are and, aside from a few exceptions such as heal and greater heroism, potions only come for spell of level 3 or lower. Master Alchemist can brew you a potion of up to spell level 7, such as energy immunity or Shadow Shield.

Here is a problem. Heal and Greater Heroism are GREAT potions while shadow shield is good and energy immunity barely ok, and only good in few situations.

Most of the time potions you'll really need are Heal and GH. I wouldn't call them "few exceptions" when those are the exceptions that actually matter.
There are some things that can be done here:

1 increase general price
2 lower appraise bonus just for potions
3 combo of 1 and 2
4 remove those from vendors

Otherwise yea that extra CL and bigger potion selection is nice but seriously - heal is something endgame chars will chug like crazy while they'll buy from actual alchemist just couple pots for situational quests or for specific places they want to explore. With just heal potions merchants can potentially have better income than any alchemist. I mean sure I like cheap pots, but it just makes no sense economy-wise that people who actually make potions need to pay more for those.

[Monnock777]

I agree it should be cheaper to buy from the source rather than the vender. Weather it be scribed scrolls or potions. It also give the player base a chance to control the market a little more.

[Monnock777]

Finally, while gold has far more value now with epic shops and more long term consumables available, it is also far easier to acquire gold than it was before the changes went in to increase the chance of something good in the loot tables. While Epics are still rare (as they should be) a smart looter that establishes one of the many decent runs can earn gold at an extremely fast rate, especially if they purchase and use those consumables available until they can acquire top end gear. Spend ~1,000 gold pieces on consumables for an hour loot run and even mid-level PC's can make an average of around 30K in that hour, EASY... It is very possible to get one lucky item and clear six figures.

Not everyone want to do loot run after loot run. But I think the agreement is why have a class that very limited to what they can sell since most potion people want are at venders for cheaper prices. I understand your point on wanting potions available to people who play during non peak hours