ToT Patch 1.2 (July 18th) Bug Reports

[Rhifox]

Please report any bugs in the new 1.2 patch for ToT here.

[Steve]

Subject: ToT Patch 1.1 (July 7th) Bug Reports

And I'm saying, Polymorph and Shapechange are spell-like abilities. This only affects Shifter's Polymorph-at-Will and Shapechange-at-Will class features. Its other features, all of the shifter-specific shapes, are all supernatural.

Okay. Continuing the conversation here.

I for one didn’t think that Shifters needed to differentiate between having a SLA ability and a Wild Shape ability, but that this only is an OOC bases mechanics issue.

But either way, if casting a Spell so that one can gain a Supernatural Ability because of either IC or OOC reasons is the answer, fine. I just will RP around it’s mechanical limitations.

I was just hoping it could be fixed to be smoother and more IC to the PrC being a special transformation into a certain kind of Being.

Which IS how I RP my toon.

[Nyssis]

Textures are missing on female MP armor appearances 27 through 30.

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[Rhifox]

Subject: ToT Patch 1.1 (July 7th) Bug Reports

And I'm saying, Polymorph and Shapechange are spell-like abilities. This only affects Shifter's Polymorph-at-Will and Shapechange-at-Will class features. Its other features, all of the shifter-specific shapes, are all supernatural.

Okay. Continuing the conversation here.

I for one didn’t think that Shifters needed to differentiate between having a SLA ability and a Wild Shape ability, but that this only is an OOC bases mechanics issue.

But either way, if casting a Spell so that one can gain a Supernatural Ability because of either IC or OOC reasons is the answer, fine. I just will RP around it’s mechanical limitations.

I was just hoping it could be fixed to be smoother and more IC to the PrC being a special transformation into a certain kind of Being.

Which IS how I RP my toon.

Even in pnp, shifters only get shifting as a supernatural ability starting at level 6 (out of 10). Prior to that, it's spell-like.

As for our version, well, it's entirely custom and doesn't match the pnp version... pretty much at all. And to make those two abilities Supernatural would require duplicating both the Polymorph and Shapechange spell rows and linking the shifter versions of the feats to them. It's a lot of work for something that's frankly only a side-benefit of being a shifter, that only has 16% chance of failing in Wild Magic just when first casting the spell (but not when changing shape).

The special transformation is the shifter wildshapes, those are what BG's version of shifter are built around, and those are supernatural.

So while it can be done, it's not really very high priority.

[Steve]

Subject: ToT Patch 1.1 (July 7th) Bug Reports

And I'm saying, Polymorph and Shapechange are spell-like abilities. This only affects Shifter's Polymorph-at-Will and Shapechange-at-Will class features. Its other features, all of the shifter-specific shapes, are all supernatural.

Okay. Continuing the conversation here.

I for one didn’t think that Shifters needed to differentiate between having a SLA ability and a Wild Shape ability, but that this only is an OOC bases mechanics issue.

But either way, if casting a Spell so that one can gain a Supernatural Ability because of either IC or OOC reasons is the answer, fine. I just will RP around it’s mechanical limitations.

I was just hoping it could be fixed to be smoother and more IC to the PrC being a special transformation into a certain kind of Being.

Which IS how I RP my toon.

Even in pnp, shifters only get shifting as a supernatural ability starting at level 6 (out of 10). Prior to that, it's spell-like.

As for our version, well, it's entirely custom and doesn't match the pnp version... pretty much at all. And to make those two abilities Supernatural would require duplicating both the Polymorph and Shapechange spell rows and linking the shifter versions of the feats to them. It's a lot of work for something that's frankly only a side-benefit of being a shifter, that only has 16% chance of failing in Wild Magic just when first casting the spell (but not when changing shape).

The special transformation is the shifter wildshapes, those are what BG's version of shifter are built around, and those are supernatural.

So while it can be done, it's not really very high priority.

Yeah, I totally understand your logic here.

[Shadostorm]

This was already happening prior patch but no fix/mention:

so the AC for word of changing forms (at least the planetar and cornugon forms) is capping out still and is +dodge/-other AC on char sheet. Increasing CE and defensively fighting after that breakpoint only changes the bonus but doesn't raise AC any higher but still reduces AB. For instance my warlock as planetar caps at 54 ac with ce 1. going up to ce 5 and defensive fighting doesn't raise the AC higher than 54. Cornugon form caps at 56, same thing...the dodge bonus on char sheet goes up but the other ac value goes down for the amount changed. have screenshots if needed i could pm on discord

[Oarthias]

Textures are missing on female MP armor appearances 27 through 30.

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This will hopefully be fixed next update -

[Exrodie]

Unfortunately looks like Feint is still looking for 13 Dex.

RCR'd toon with 14 Intelligence (and 9 Dex) and CE at Level 1. In 8 level ups, Feint was never an option.

To test, I RCR'd and started with 14 Int and 13 Dex with CE at Level 1. At level 3, Feint was available from feat pick list.

[Steve]

This was already happening prior patch but no fix/mention:

so the AC for word of changing forms (at least the planetar and cornugon forms) is capping out still and is +dodge/-other AC on char sheet. Increasing CE and defensively fighting after that breakpoint only changes the bonus but doesn't raise AC any higher but still reduces AB. For instance my warlock as planetar caps at 54 ac with ce 1. going up to ce 5 and defensive fighting doesn't raise the AC higher than 54. Cornugon form caps at 56, same thing...the dodge bonus on char sheet goes up but the other ac value goes down for the amount changed. have screenshots if needed i could pm on discord

Are you hitting the Dodge AC cap here? A lot of Shapechange AC IS Dodge AC. And FD/CE AC is also Dodge.

[DaloLorn]

Unfortunately looks like Feint is still looking for 13 Dex.

RCR'd toon with 14 Intelligence (and 9 Dex) and CE at Level 1. In 8 level ups, Feint was never an option.

To test, I RCR'd and started with 14 Int and 13 Dex with CE at Level 1. At level 3, Feint was available from feat pick list.

Bah, my fix got overwritten. It'll be corrected in the next HAK patch.

[Shadostorm]

This was already happening prior patch but no fix/mention:

so the AC for word of changing forms (at least the planetar and cornugon forms) is capping out still and is +dodge/-other AC on char sheet. Increasing CE and defensively fighting after that breakpoint only changes the bonus but doesn't raise AC any higher but still reduces AB. For instance my warlock as planetar caps at 54 ac with ce 1. going up to ce 5 and defensive fighting doesn't raise the AC higher than 54. Cornugon form caps at 56, same thing...the dodge bonus on char sheet goes up but the other ac value goes down for the amount changed. have screenshots if needed i could pm on discord

Are you hitting the Dodge AC cap here? A lot of Shapechange AC IS Dodge AC. And FD/CE AC is also Dodge.

not sure how hitting the cap now would lower my AC from pre-patch from over 60-62ac to mid-50s now

[Theodore01]

That was in the discord dev-syn feed a few days ago. Whatever slightly means here "Word of Changing Planetar forms slightly reduced in AC."

[Shadostorm]

That was in the discord dev-syn feed a few days ago. Whatever slightly means here "Word of Changing Planetar forms slightly reduced in AC."

and the Cornugon which wasn't touched losing the same? This isn't relative to the beginning of the patch vs this most recent patch version. This is compared to before this whole patch cycle.

[DaloLorn]

It's the Dodge AC cap. Cornugon and Planetar shapes have a NATURALACBONUS of 16, and for some weird reason, polymorph "natural" AC is counted as Dodge AC. (This also means you need Uncanny Dodge to be a competent shapeshifter.) Considering the cap is 20... it's not at all difficult to max out your AC.

More relevant to your report: Fighting Defensively and the new CE grant Dodge AC, which also counts towards the cap. The old CE was untyped AC, but we can't grant that.

[Shadostorm]

so the AC loss is because you replaced a fully functional CE that was untyped AC with more dodge AC...that explains the 6 ac difference. So basically you nerfed any shifting class using CE because most were already capped on dodge AC so they lose the untyped AC...

I'll take the old CE back please instead of a direct nerf.