RP club

For Issues, Ideas, or Subjects That Do Not Fit Elsewhere

Moderators: Moderator, DM

User avatar
Zanniej
Posts: 2454
Joined: Sat Jan 11, 2014 11:28 am
Location: The dark parts of the forum

RP club

Unread post by Zanniej »

A build I once made, and a reply on the Bard & FS nerf topic got me thinking. I've got a challenge to all you die-hard RP enthousiasts:

Make a build, where everything is made purely out of an RP perspective, and nothing, I repeat, nothing is taken because of the mechanical advantages it brings. Examples are:
  • A rogue without HiPS
  • A fighter without UMD or Cleric dip
  • Any pure toon that isn't OP by itself ( Sure, druid/bard/FS 30 is also viable for this plan, but they're already really strong by themselves )
Dips wouldn't be allowed, muling wouldn't be allowed, and multiclassing would be kept to a minimum.

Thoughts? Suggestions? I'm all ears!
Off to greener pastures
User avatar
Steve
Recognized Donor
Posts: 8193
Joined: Wed Jul 08, 2015 5:42 am
Location: Paradise in GMT +1

Re: RP club

Unread post by Steve »

I know the build...it's called Drake Nair! :lol:

Essaar Arkae

Tsarzyn Ek'cla - Superiority Supreme

Khelboros Wyrmstone
User avatar
Invoker
Retired Staff
Posts: 1391
Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2014 5:21 pm

Re: RP club

Unread post by Invoker »

Cool thread Zanniej! And kudos on the player counter, I just read the thread :).

Good job!

A couple of questions:

-) Why would you think a Rogue without HiPS is more of an RP build with respect to a Rogue with it?

-) When you say limit multiclass to a minimum, what is your thought process? (for instance, not only the classes you mentioned, but also Warlock, Monk, Cleric and Ranger for instance are very strong pure and keep improving level after level, whereas there is little point for a Fighter, Sorcerer or Spirit Shaman to stay pure)
This twisted culture got you feeding from its hand
But you will lose that food if you don't meet all their demands
And loyal is the soldier that gets slaughtered with the lambs
Examining the blueprints got you questioning the plans
User avatar
Mac
Recognized Donor
Posts: 293
Joined: Mon Jan 30, 2012 8:46 pm
Location: California, Usa

Re: RP club

Unread post by Mac »

A rogue without HiPS
A fighter without UMD or Cleric dip
My main is a barbarian with out UMD or Cleric levels. Not a strong build but having a lot of fun with him.

A rogue without HiPS could be a utility type rouge. The player who can find and disarm all them traps, Someone to handle all the tricky locks. Maybe he/she can even lay some traps of there own or have great social skills for talking down that angry lich queen?
Former DM Creo 2017 CC Appointed Jul 27 2016 Removed May 21 2017
Sara Denton "Ashley" Fled the Swords Coast
Macgar Blackbrew Returned to Tribe Raymar
Belladonna (Dead) Once Captain of the Dragonwing Outlaw, Pirate & Friend
Nroc Living a life at sea
Damienknight
Recognized Donor
Posts: 19
Joined: Wed Mar 02, 2016 3:17 pm

Re: RP club

Unread post by Damienknight »

Imagine a world chocked full of magical trinkets. You go out risking your life every day fighting mystical creatures and finding magical loot. But... you decide that you are not going to use these magical trinkets. Nevermind they would make your life much easier, if not save it on a regular basis. You are going to adamantly attempt to get on without using the magical trinkets.

An adventurer who doesnt get UMD either has a magical buddy they always hang out with, or they are like an army that uses horses instead of vehicles, carrier pigeons instead of radios, and throws rocks instead of shooting guns.

Its actually very unrealistic RP. Unless you are playing someone who is kinda stupid maybe?

I will never get the fantasy connection between playing willfully weak characters and good RP. Good RP could lead to a weak build, but weak builds will not help you have better RP. RP is not the numbers on your character sheet, it is playing who your character is, in the situation they are in.

When people are doing a dangerous thing, they research it and then prepare themselves. Every climber who goes up Mount Everest is going to have a climbing harness and warm coat. Anyone who stands at the bottom of the mountain and tells people in order to be a real climber they need to leave their climbing gear at the bottom is just taking a piss.
Ivan38Rus
Retired Staff
Posts: 1417
Joined: Sat Aug 08, 2009 11:44 pm

Re: RP club

Unread post by Ivan38Rus »

One of my first builds on this server was recreation of my PnP character from ADND days:
It was a Fighter 10 / Rogue 10 with a ton of feats invested into boosting his saves (iron will, lighting reflexes, etc)
User avatar
Planehopper
Posts: 2297
Joined: Sun Oct 09, 2011 4:50 pm

Re: RP club

Unread post by Planehopper »

Man, I have played these builds quite a few times over the years. I have had a lot of fun with them. I don't limit multiclassing, but I like to make a character that has feats that match the backstory, and then only take feats that fit current RP.

I've played Jarek Twostacks, a rogue focused primarily on pick pockets and locks/traps, whose backstory had him as more of a thug than sneak.

Maranna Weylraun, who I still have, is basically a healer. She sucks in combat, but she is also supposed to be an old lady so it fits. I can't imagine a 60 year old woman throwin down with a dragon. Since she has only ever cared about healing, that's really all she's developed toward. She used monkey grip to carry staff/shield, and lots of healing-enhancing feats.

My gnome, Wizzelbert Cranksproket, who is intended to be a Techsmith (if they leave it open to Arcanes), is definitely not built with power in mind, but rather his backstory of tinkering/alchemy...and creating disasters.

Oh, and my bro has played plenty of successful melee types without UMD. I try to stay away from it unless it fits the actual class, too. I personally feel that the prolific use of UMD is immersion breaking as hell, and even though you are exponentially more prepared to fight higher level mobs with UMD-able scrolls/wands, it just seems silly to me.

Anyway, I've liked playing all of them. Sadly, however, it seems like there was a long stretch of time where the base difficulty of the module was significantly increased, making such builds more difficult to have even mild success. I am NOT saying that a craptastical build should be able to solo areas of their CR - I don't think they should - but the higher level areas in particular are difficult to even survive in groups if you aren't playing a purpose-built character.

That may or may not be the case these days. I haven't really played enough since I came back around to tell you.
Last edited by Planehopper on Thu May 05, 2016 12:23 pm, edited 2 times in total.
User avatar
Snarfy
Posts: 1430
Joined: Sun Jun 12, 2011 12:14 pm

Re: RP club

Unread post by Snarfy »

Steve wrote:I know the build...it's called Drake Nair! :lol:
Zing!

To the OP, I make RP concepts all the time. Actually, probably a third of my characters are the non-optimized variety, here are some examples of ideas I have(most of which I haven't leveled up yet, likely because it's bloody painful :lol: ):

The venerable Zen Spirit-Archer, Arnyle Huxley, who weilds the shortbow he used in his childhood, and wants to heal the lands after the war.

Maal Cierith, a mute half-elven cave-stalker/shadow(gimp-a-riffic), who had his tongue cut out by mean old drow, and is focused on surviving rather than revenge.

Gurble, the stuttering and unwitting frost-summoner, whose only ambitions in life are to one day create a giant snow-man companion, befriend a yeti, and to continue doodling cartoons of his muse, Auril.

Then of course there's Bard-Bari-hin!!!. :mrgreen:

Another character I always wanted to make was an elven wizard bowyer, who specialized in crafting magical bows, like this guy. Alas, since crafting isn't really implemented he will likely never see the light of day.

And those are but a few... truth be told, I think of more RP concept builds than mechanically viable ones(mostly because I don't know how to build!).
There are no level 30's, only level 20's with benefits...
chad878262
Posts: 9332
Joined: Thu Sep 18, 2014 6:55 pm

Re: RP club

Unread post by chad878262 »

How about a dexterity based, TWF Ranger/Assassin with most crit immune/damage resistant enemies NOT on the FE list for him? :oops:
Chord Silverstrings - Bard and OSR Squire / Tarent Nefzen - Arcane Wand Merchant and Master Alchemist / Irrace Arkentlar - Drow Adventurer / Finneaus Du'Veil - Gem Merchant and Executive Officer of SCCE

Tarent's Wands and Elixirs

A Wand Crafter's guide to using wands
User avatar
Rhifox
Posts: 3962
Joined: Wed Jan 13, 2016 2:34 am

Re: RP club

Unread post by Rhifox »

Zanniej wrote:Make a build, where everything is made purely out of an RP perspective, and nothing, I repeat, nothing is taken because of the mechanical advantages it brings.
Characters can be strong or weak depending on the character. An RP concept does not require being weak. What it requires is having every choice justified and prompted by the character concept. Sometimes this will lead to weakness, sometimes it will lead to strength.

Simply, for an RP build, every class, feat, attribute score, or skill rank needs to answer one question: "Why?" If a build can answer that question while remaining mechanically potent? Then more power to it. But if it can't, then things should be adjusted.

My current build's choices, and the RP reasons for them:
Hidden: show
Classes
Tarina is a hedge mage, a witch. Her concept is that of a lone magic user of humble origins and mannerisms who has had to learn as she goes along. She has limited understanding of how she does what she does and is reliant on associations and pacts with supernatural entities that both aid her and lead her to temptation. All of my character choices are made with this in mind. Therefore, for classes, I've gone with spirit shaman and thaumaturge.

Other class combinations I've considered for the character are Shaman/Sorcerer/Blood Mage, Shaman/Warlock, and Shaman/Sorcerer/Thaumaturge. Essentially, the classes I associate with the character are shaman, sorcerer, warlock, blood mage, and thaumaturge, and any build considerations I have made are done with those classes in mind. Anything outside of those is not acceptable, because other classes do not fit the character concept I am playing (such as warpriest and hierophant, which while useful for divine casters like shamans, represent a place within an established religious hierarchy and so do not fit the hedge mage concept).

Attributes
Points are spread out between most stats to maintain a relatively "mundane" character. I tend to view 12 as the 'baseline' for adventurers in the same manner that 10 is the baseline for NPCs, as DnD considers adventurers a cut above NPCs by default. Natural stats at level 1 for my build are 12Str, 12Dex, 15Con, 12Int, 15Wis, 12Cha. Even at 30, no single stat gets higher than 20 before equipment (two points go into Wis, the rest into Constitution). Cha is the one stat that feels a bit high for the character, though I've still left it very low for the class.

Feats
  • Metamagic:
    Tarina is quiet and soft-spoken, being afraid to speak loudly, so Silent Spell is a must. Empower Spell is also desirable, because the character tends towards brute force responses to situations and can be explosive in temper. Extend Spell is the one that has little real RP purpose and is only there for quality-of-life, and is the first feat I'm likely to drop if I feel something more ICly suited comes along.
  • Spell Focuses:
    Conjuration, Evocation, Divination, and Necromancy make up Tarina's favored schools, and so I try to take Focus feats for at least two of these to represent her, well, focus. With such low cha there's no way I can really pump my DC even with blood magic, so spell focus feats are kind of wasted, but they are a good way of saying something about the character so I take them anyway.
  • No Spellcasting Prodigy:
    Tarina is a sorcerer who didn't have the strength of personality to actually manifest sorcerous powers to any great degree and turned to essentially begging spirits and using blood magic to get magic in other ways. There's nothing prodigal about that, so there is no sense in taking prodigy regardless of how mechanically useful it is.
  • Blood Magic:
    Actually the biggest reason why I chose to focus on shaman instead of going warlock or sorcerer/blood mage, as blood magic was one of the essentials for my concept and I likely would have ditched spirit magic before ditching blood magic if I had had to make the choice. I'm very happy that BG offers this feat, it's one of the more significant feats for my RP and something that I so far use in RP more than I use in combat (as summons and buffing party members are my main combat tools).
  • Telthor:
    A natural pick for a character focused on communing with spirits, though I do dislike how the feat doesn't give any options for customizing the spirit companion.
  • Fiery Burst:
    The one part of Tarina's sorcerous heritage that comes through. Used in RP any time her emotions rise and she lashes out with uncontrolled bursts of magic. Though not particularly useful in PvE, it's an essential feat for my RP concept.
Spells
No water or ice spells, because the character is a divine caster whose primal patron is Kossuth. This means no Greater Creeping Doom and no Ice Storm, despite being some of the better attack spells for SS.

Multiple spells are also chosen specifically for RP, even in spite of taking up my very precious Spells Known slots. More or less mechanically useless spells I've taken include Omen of Peril, Sleep (though I do wonder why druid list gets Sleep but not Deep Slumber or Hiss, which would allow me to actually have a useful sleep spell...), Detect Charm, Detect Scrying, Greater Scrying, and so on.

Skills
Skill points are spread out according to the character's actual skills, not for maximizing checks. Few skills have more than 5 ranks. The only skill other than Listen/Spot that gets higher than 20 points by level 30 is Concentration, though I'm debating lowering this as the character has had difficulties with concentration in RP.

Spellcraft is left at 5, despite being a class skill with obvious benefits (saves at every 5 ranks, ability to take epic spells...). The character has no understanding of magical theory or how spells work. She knows just enough to apply the magic she gets from the spirits. More spellcraft than this would not make sense.

UMD is taken, but this is because as a shaman I feel it is very important to the concept to be able to coax out the magic in items. For a shaman with animist beliefs, making a magic item work means appealing to its spirit and convincing it to aid you. Think fetishes, charms, talismans, and the like. For this reason I am also debating taking Craft Wand and/or Craft Wondrous Items later (as well as Imbue Item spells once/if they are made available), to represent the inverse of binding spirits to physical objects.

Listen and Spot are where I pump skill points, as this represents the greater perception afforded by having spirits always whispering secret knowledge in your ear (there's a reason why level 1 of shaman gives the Alertness feat).
That's for my current main character. I do similar with any character I make. For me the most important part of a class isn't its abilities, it's the description.
Last edited by Rhifox on Sat Apr 02, 2016 8:00 am, edited 1 time in total.
Tarina — The Witch of Darkhold, a dealer in spirits and black magic
User avatar
tankteddy
Posts: 442
Joined: Wed Jul 06, 2011 7:45 am
Location: NV-USA

Re: RP club

Unread post by tankteddy »

The four fighter levels can be swapped out for monk but the extra feats makes it so you don't have to try an buy a monk belt worth over 1mill. It's all about fist of fire and fire breath based off Iroh from Avatar the Last air bender.
http://nwn2db.com/build/?237064
Nevarra Stayanoga "A wolf will always be a wolf."
Thar Kogan "A har Thar!"
Theodar Battleforge: "Oi! What dis do?" *BOOM*
User avatar
Darradarljod
Posts: 795
Joined: Sat Jan 22, 2011 7:15 pm

Re: RP club

Unread post by Darradarljod »

I rolled an Ilmateri cleric called Sigma. Physically he is useless. He's taken v taken vows of nonviolence, chastity and poverty so he uses all his gold on healing kits (starting gold) and depends on church support to fund his mission of a wandering healer. Wears only unenchanted robes. No weapons. His mechanical strength is his healing skill focus and his cleric spells for easing suffering. Level two was gained purely by RP XP. And most of level three. Being strongly role focused means he is dependant on a team. That lines me up with constant RP which is nice.

A challenge to play. an enjoyable challenge at that.
NegInfinity
Posts: 2449
Joined: Wed Feb 05, 2014 11:24 am

Re: RP club

Unread post by NegInfinity »

Zanniej wrote:I've got a challenge to all you die-hard RP enthousiasts:
Die-hard? :-\

If you want a "RP build' start with random stats without planning ahead, then try to make it stronger through leveling.

For example, sorcerer with 11..12 cha would be a great start.

I did play at least 3 seriously hampered characters, but there's not much point in talking about that....
User avatar
Bobthehero
Posts: 467
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2011 2:45 am

Re: RP club

Unread post by Bobthehero »

Lotrik is a shortfused/quick to anger/really strong Genasi that has been using longsword as a tool of the trade for over twenty years. He's also rather fascinated by dragons, in a way where he'll use their abilities to kill them and take their soul for Gagaros.

So he's a 14 Fighter/5 Frenzied Berzerker/7 Weapon Master/4 Dragon Warrior guy. No UMD.

The levels are optimized, that's about it.
Aurelien Amon: Human fighter, member of the Whitewood Vanguard, Hoarite

Lotrik: Not a wise Genasi, probably stronger than you tho, a master of longswords. Fully retired

Bob Thairo: Dreadknight of Bane, Back on the Coast, tyranning away with his wife
User avatar
Lanzlo
Posts: 125
Joined: Wed Feb 24, 2016 8:35 pm

Re: RP club

Unread post by Lanzlo »

Um, folks... what's the first rule of RP Club?

Oh, wait, never mind. I'm confusing that with Fight Club...
Post Reply

Return to “General Discussion”