Balancing the server?

[tankteddy]

First off I am not here to bite anyone's head off or anything, this is just my opinion on the matter.

With the recent changes coming to the server including Bard, Clerics/favored souls, and many many more. I feel the Development team has opened Pandora's Box. Yes I personally see why some of the changes are needed/wanted/unwanted and more. Some changes I agree with and disagree with. However! I know if done right you could bring about some much needed balance, and role play to the server as a whole. Where players need to rely on each other and not just how big their sword is. Personally some classes lack the flare they are made for and I say this in terms of a cleric should never be stronger in plain combat over a fighter. A bard should never make a better rogue. I personally would love to see Megaplot NPC not have to have damage reduction 90% from everything under the sun.

This being said all member of the community Staff, Devs, QC and DMs need to realize that by doing this you will have backlash regardless of if you helped make the choice or not. Not doing anything is not an excuse to get off the hook. IF there comes a change that players/staff/devs/dms dont like we need to voice this matter peacefully! And find a way to balance the issues at hand. To my knowledge BG has always been influenced by the player base at large. We make the world we want to play in. The staff and teams we have DONATE their time to make it OUR world. Be patient and let's hope in the end the changes, while some may hurt, will benefit us more in the end.

To the Staff!
Remember to Listen to your players! You play here as well! You are give us so much and get so little in return. I hope the backlash will not sway you from your path. Your assistance has made BG the amazing server it is today. And while the future is uncertain I move forward with both fear and excitement to the changes to come. Please don't give up.

To everyone thank you and I hope we can push threw this and remember it's the Role play that matters far more then what you have or can and can't do on your own. Sometimes the loss is better then the win as it give you the goal to achieve something great!

[Maecius]

All change brings mixed reactions. Some people thrive on it. Some people react against it. Sometimes it depends on how it impacts you personally, other times it's the very fact that something's changing that causes anxiety.

Certainly, the amount of trust any given player has in the staff plays a big role too. If you trust that the staff are doing what they're doing for the good of the server (at least as they see it), that's one thing. If you believe it's for some ulterior motive, then you're going to react against that, too.

From what I've seen, a handful of players are unhappy with the forthcoming changes, and a handful of players are pleased with them, while most players either don't seem to care enough to comment or just don't see them as a big deal.

I do want to correct a slight misrepresentation of intent, as characterized in the very title of this thread: I don't think anyone staff side holds the belief that the server, or Dungeons & Dragons, can ever be "balanced." That's not quite what this is about.

For many years we've buffed up a good deal of content, with the philosophy being that "wow, there are some really OP things in this game ... buuut players hate nerfs. Let's just try to make the crappy stuff better until we reach some sort of equilibrium." Unfortunately, over time, this simply created a different sort of power creep, and it never really closed the circle on the "wow, there are some really OP things in this game" angle. Those things stayed OP the whole time.

This is an effort by the developers to respec some of those overpowered items. In several cases, the overpowered items are things we introduced ourselves (since, for example, and if I'm not mistaken, we introduced the heirophant class and the northlander hewing combat style feat here on BG:TSCC, neither of which are in the vanilla campaign), and those things are simply being corrected now.

I doubt this will be the last change we make to mechanics. We have no intention of stopping the development pipeline -- and as new content is introduced, some of it's going to need to be changed over time. Indeed, some changes may even be reversed later on if it's determined that we went too far with a given nerf or buff (e.g., the first iteration of ki step). But, ultimately, one of the server's strengths (if, admittedly, also one of the areas in which it sometimes frustrates people) is the fact that it does still have, after ten years, active player development and storytelling.

By definition, that means it'll probably never stand still. At least, that is, until development stops in the last few cycles before the server closes its eyes and lies down to rest for good.

[Wolfrayne]

Honestly i think the biggest problem with the changes we have on the server is the lack of communication and/or reasoning for a change. People dont like it when suddenly their favorite class/skill/spell/whatever is suddenly and dramatically changed.

its all well and good to say "the staff talk about it and decide" which is great and all but then where is the heads up to players to say "hey we are changing this for x reasons and even if you don't agree with players reactions and still go ahead with the change at least its been in an open and honest forum rather than someone reading a quick post or change log and getting upset because there is absolutely no context or reasoning as to why the change is happening.

Instead of treating players like children who need to be policed all the time why not show them that you are at least listening to what they have to say and respond accordingly.

Communication is incredibly important. I mean look at the recent changes you made to the DM team. Its obvious that the big issue is and always seems to be lack of proper communication.

[TheKai]

Im on the other side of the coin. Im not management here, but I am in RL and I dont share every reason why I make a decision, to my employees or customers. If I feel like they need to know, I tell them. If not, I dont.

Im perfectly okay with whichever decisions the staff makes. Theyre the staff, after all. As a player, I feel privileged to play and able to create stories here, not entitled to explanations on x, y, or z. Im not paying a sub or anything.

[c2k]

Divine Power was always on the watch list since they nerfed Battletide. I don't know what exactly changed for staff to pull the trigger, but it probably has to do with all the other balancing changes and tuning that have occurred such Expose Weakness for example. It likely made them feel comfortable with hitting Divine Power at this point of time. I can't say with certainty, but in the end, maybe all of this Divine class power descaling is opening up new content for Divine classes.

[Darker_Thought]

Though I may not personally agree with all changes that has been made on this Server, I do fully agree with that some plasters(decisions) just needs to be ripped off for the long-lasting health of the server. Certain things may benefit from a constructive dialogue with players but its a thin balance to walk between what the masses want and what the server objectively may need.

A thing that comes to mind at this point is to always view these changes from multiple angles. If you play an FS (like myself) you might not personally love e.g. the Divine Power changes,) but try to think of the whole server. There will certainly always be arguments for both sides of the coin but... In the end all I(or we) want is for this place to continue to evolve and provide new interesting experiences for us to dive into

Furthermore, perhaps some more detailed reasoning for the changes to keep players informed as previous players have commented on this thread would result in a feeling of inclusion and being up-to-date with the changes(From a players perspective).

What I do know however, and I believe this can not be said enough, is that the staff is putting down some hardcore charity donations of their time to make this place work. Nearly a decade has passed now since it started and it still amazes me today that it is still going. No matter the tensions due to these changes I think a lot of us players are extremely thankful to have had, or currently be able to log into this Server to continue the unique role-play opportunities this world has to offer.

[Ewe]

I'd just like to remind everyone of the Design Philosophy of the server, as posted on the wiki:

"To do whatever works to make the server a nicer place to play"

https://wiki.bgtscc.net/index.php?title ... Philosophy

Also, I may have missed it, but I don't see anywhere in the "2018-2020 BGTSCC Strategic Planning Document" anything about prioritizing player ability nerfs.

viewtopic.php?f=4&t=62280

Some things it does read,

The very highest priorities in all that the development team does should be server stability, systems reliability, and player enjoyment.

Quality Control will remain a vital component to the server’s staff structure, and should be utilized by all developers.

I have seen player concerns regarding devs skipping over QC, and also placing pet projects over the actual server priorities.

Additionally, lack of effective communication. When asked for specific reasoning on some things, the devs just say something along "it's be talked to death in old threads over the years." I find not offering a final developer reasoning and hand waving it like that isn't very good communication. Further, the posted formulas were not actually correct which makes the communication suffer even more.