Server Direction (! or ?)

[Tekill]

This the suggestion box thread?

What were the good old days like?

Probably the number one thing that the good old days had over now is population. The game was new and fairly popular once- simple as that.

But the difference today is that the server is mechanically, a pretty finely tuned world. It can still draw new players but can it keep them for awhile?

I like DM events of any size. Whatever the dm decides is fine by me because I simply enjoy the randomness of it. If one says I only like X type of events, it takes away from that randomness and will then get boring. It would be like having pizza for supper every day for the rest of your life.

I do not see dm'ing as being much of an issue. It most likely will never be perfect. Perhaps the DM's can sprinkle in a couple more skill checks, other than spot.

I see the players freedom as being the issue. I hate to sound like a stinkin filthy druid here, but there needs to be a balance.

For Example:
I think perhaps some of what made it the bad old days was the ooc drama and hurt feelings related to pvp. I am guessing that with the evolution of the pvp rules over the years it has minimized a lot of ooc conflict.

But it has also minimizes in character (IC) conflict as well. Streamlining the server to eliminate situations where people would become upset, has had the counter affect of making things boring.

For Example:
The lack of attension antagonistic players or factions, receive on this server.

You start with banning murder hobos for random killings. Then you examing ad address how a certain type of faction tends to cause more trouble than good. Maybe you then start favoring the factions that get along with everyone first, over the ones that do not.

Then one day a couple years down the road you see any player wearing all black as the standard player to ignore, so you completely ignore them because hes clearly a Saturday Morning Villian. From that point you basically ignore any player you disagree or bothers you because that is whats acceptable.

My Suggestion:
To create the balance you have to review the rules (written and unwritten) made in the past to see if they hold up with current rules and the ways the game is being played in the present. It starts out as an attempt to control the murder hobos but over time it evolves into repression that limits the actions of everyone. But if you review existing rules from time to time, and risk upsetting the order, it will create new opportunites.

For Example:
Permanently elimitating a player led 'policing' faction in the server because players abused the power in the past.
With the new pvp rules is that rule still necessary?
Why cant I become a duke for that matter? The game has been around for 10 years- the system is now afine tuned masterpiece, and yet my player can not even be a soldier in the flaming fist or a politician in The Gates govenance?

There is very little trouble being caused by players on the server, compared to the past, and that is great. But the players are now closed off from each other and it stifles what we can do as players.

If we start by reexamining the rules, it could free us up to create a really immersive version of Baldur's Gate. This would bring back some of the players that moved on and bring in new ones.

Oh and a crafting system....players seem to like crafting for some reason.(A simulation of work- is still too much like real work for me, but to each their own).

[c2k]

I don't think there is anymore red tape here now then there has been over the last 7-8 years. I lurk every few months to see whats changing, and all it seems is there is more organization at the top, though its understandable with 2 admins leaving there is uncertainty.

Also, in my heyday, most(not all) veteran players did tend to ignore the newer players unless the new players did a dance catch the attention of those veteran players or if the new players somehow found themselves in an event.(because the vets, at least during my time, did clamor to be in every event) And then you had the vets who just want to see whats the most broken thing that can drop from the loot tables in X amount of farming runs, and they really don't care about anyone.


I do agree, the server would almost certainly be better off if ivory towers were destroyed and the cliques dissolved, but you are also talking years and years in the development of these structures, so I'm not sure anything can be done from the outside.

[Hoihe]

I don't think there is anymore red tape here now then there has been over the last 7-8 years. I lurk every few months to see whats changing, and all it seems is there is more organization at the top, though its understandable with 2 admins leaving there is uncertainty.

Also, in my heyday, most(not all) veteran players did tend to ignore the newer players unless the new players did a dance catch the attention of those veteran players or if the new players somehow found themselves in an event.(because the vets, at least during my time, did clamor to be in every event) And then you had the vets who just want to see whats the most broken thing that can drop from the loot tables in X amount of farming runs, and they really don't care about anyone.


I do agree, the server would almost certainly be better off if ivory towers were destroyed and the cliques dissolved, but you are also talking years and years in the development of these structures, so I'm not sure anything can be done from the outside.

Cliques are kind of a natural product of wildly differing, incompatible RP preferences.

Folk who enjoy dark fantasy and downer RP won't really get along with those who hate that, and likely vice versa. There are people who call entire aspects of the server's RP "Filler RP", while others only really enjoy that kind of stuff, with everything else being supporting foundation.

[Agog_Fr]

My opinion is that we need a more hardcore RP orientation for the server and more DMs.

That's why I am very reluctant to anything that is farming, crafting, grinding. For me, these notions should not even exist on an RP server.

Introducing a craft system will not change anything, it will satisfy players who love the race to power, but it is an illusion to believe that it will create RP.


We need to focus on the heart of the RP: one DMs and few players, and the freedom to change the world, where the actions of PCs have a real impact.

But DMs can not be decreed. As Maecius said you have to find passionate and honest people, it's difficult.

[Steve]

Thank you to those offering positive suggestions, and to those trying to tease out somewhat heavy/maybe negative issues, but being conscious to not be attacking.

It has to be said, of course, that any time/energy/effort spent by Human Beings to make this Server Live, is something to be appreciated. But like all positions, especially those of Power, it is challenging to step out of that Role, look at ones position and actions, and determine if their current Role is being beneficial, on a whole, or not. How to adjust, how to be conscious of those you "manage," and how to work together openly. It's kinda like Life, and good business practice. Being quite anonymous as we are on BGTSCC as a whole, does not always help.

I know first hand what it is like to be "at the top" on BGTSCC and balance that Work with Enjoyment with Real Life, etc. And as has been said by others, supporting those willing to take up the bigger load, is important. And, if you feel there is something lacking in others, take the chance to make yourself able to take on those positions yourself, and add to the possibility of a better Server!

What I truly, truly want to encourage is that Everyone on BGTSCC, whether top or bottom, can be of REAL BENEFIT to the Server and thus the Community, as a whole. It is really like that. Maecius and Endelyon or now Miasmata and Zanniej cannot "fix it" themselves. The Head DMs, or the DM Team, neither. Devs included. They are just PARTS to the Whole, and the Players are, if you look around a bit, are the Majority of the PARTS, and it has to all come together. Right?!?!

I'm not saying something like "let's just hug and everything will be alright." What I am saying is that for the Server to have good direction, even if there is just one Captain of the Ship, there has to be good support from the Crew. And maybe yes, there DOES NEED to be a Captain on the deck, these days, that has a vision for the next adventure. I'm game for that!

I think Maecius outlined with simplicity why it is a challenge to satisfy the diverse Playerbase, in terms of "Living World" Role-play: the DM-to-Player ratio just makes that impossible. He also did make a point that the Role-play Direction may differ, or does differ, from the Technical Direction. So we all should be conscious that there are two aspects of "direction" at work, or not, currently on BGTSCC.

I would like to say, if we're here to play among other living Characters, there does need to be a bit more like this:

I have no idea where this should be—though I'd appreciate it more in Baldur's Gate itself, but....—but all the interactions possible in Role-play are only possible if you can actually find and learn about new/current/existing PCs...and know where to find them!

[Hoihe]

My opinion is that we need a more hardcore RP orientation for the server and more DMs.

That's why I am very reluctant to anything that is farming, crafting, grinding. For me, these notions should not even exist on an RP server.

Introducing a craft system will not change anything, it will satisfy players who love the race to power, but it is an illusion to believe that it will create RP.


We need to focus on the heart of the RP: one DMs and few players, and the freedom to change the world, where the actions of PCs have a real impact.

But DMs can not be decreed. As Maecius said you have to find passionate and honest people, it's difficult.

Kind of what my above post examplified. There's plenty of folk who are turned off from "hardcore" RP where hardcore isn't "Let's simulate every aspect of the character's life" but "one mistake and everything is gone".

If hardcore RP is provision of the ability to fully immerse, I'm in.
But I'm not one bit keen on playing EVE online while doing D&D. I don't want that kind of stress. And this leads to cliqueforming as some people do want that, some don't.

Some way to be inclusive to both sides without making either wanting to quit the server is the challenge in my opinion.

[c2k]

Cliques are kind of a natural product of wildly differing, incompatible RP preferences.

Folk who enjoy dark fantasy and downer RP won't really get along with those who hate that, and likely vice versa. There are people who call entire aspects of the server's RP "Filler RP", while others only really enjoy that kind of stuff, with everything else being supporting foundation.

Its certainly not the fault of staff, but rather the lack of any variety when it comes to looking for PWs on NWN2. I'm sure that close to half the people who play on this server would rather be playing on another server that fits what they are looking in a PW. BGTSCC has become refuge for everyone that wants to play NWN2 in a community, but in turn that hampers a lot of the direction that the server can go in without stepping on toes.

I'm not going to break it down further than that though, I don't think I need to.

[Tanlaus]

As a relatively new player (played on this server in the early days but it’s been so many years it’s a new experience for me) I’d like to add my perspective.

I personally feel this server has a pretty great community and a lot of great DM interaction. Since logging back in with a new account (don’t even know what my old account was named) I’ve had almost no problem finding groups or RP. I say almost because I do have a UD alt and that poor bastard is lonely

There seem to be plenty of people in the farmlands or at FAI. And it is easy enough to walk up and start talking to someone. Nine times out of ten they will be inclusive. In the other side, I have seen people just walk up to a conversation in progress and suck the air out of the room. When that happens people do tend to leave... just like real life.

I’ve had several very noticeable small group DM events where I was exploring with a group and the DM brought the world to life around us. They were great. I’ve also participated in a few of the bigger events and really enjoyed those too. I don’t want to have a giant battle every time I’m on, but once or twice a week is fun for me. And if I don’t feel up to it or don’t have the time to commit, I just don’t participate.

Just to play devil’s advocate to a few points...

I’m not part of any guild but I don’t mind exclusive guild halls. People have long ongoing storylines and sometimes need the space to play them. Standing at a campfire or in the FAI doesn’t help them or new players who happen by.

Sometimes grinding is fun. You get an impromptu group and figure out how best to work together while fighting battle after battle. Throw in some friendly often funny banter and those have been some of my most enjoyable experiences. And much like events, if that’s not your thing you don’t have to participate. Having draconian rules about RP really can and does kill the fun of the game. At least for some of us.

Overall I think some of the discontent is a forest for the trees issue. There may be specific things that bother people, especially long time players, but it’s really a great community from top to bottom.

[K'yon Oblodra]

I personally feel this server has a pretty great community and a lot of great DM interaction. Since logging back in with a new account (don’t even know what my old account was named) I’ve had almost no problem finding groups or RP. I say almost because I do have a UD alt and that poor bastard is lonely

Contact me if you see me online we'll try and change that .

Also happy to see some more DM appreciation <3

[kitteninablender]

As far as the art books and stuff:

I do own a media company. I can actually publish stuff.

And because of my job I go to comic book conventions and stuff. I do, in fact, know several of the artists for Magic the Gathering personally.

R.K. Post, Bryon "Mutt" Wackwicz, Steve Argyle, Mark Poole, Dan Frazier, just to name a few.

I'd be more than happy to do that for any of the artists here, and anybody interested in getting their work published by all means feel free to contact me either on the forums or in Discord and I can make that happen. For a nominal fee, naturally. Cuz I don't do this crap for free.

[Tekill]

Giving players more influence in the day to day functions of the game. In the past, I recommended a partially player run criminal and judicial system. You could increase that to day to day governance. Who wants to be mayor of Beregost?
It is already happening to a small degree.

But, I suppose I can make suggestions/complaints or complaint/suggestions all day long about what can be done to improve things. That would be the easy part. The hard part is actually trying to contribute in a way to make those positive changes.

I try to create a positive atmosphere when in game- even when playing evil characters (its not hard to do). I keep an eye out for new players and offer my unsolicited advice to them.

But I do not really help out more than that.
kitteninablender reminds me that I am not as important as I sometimes think I am, and that my pride can push things too far.

I am full of helpful complaints/suggestions but unless I am really willing to volunteer my time to directly try and make a difference in a positive way, then I should not expect much to change.

It is a fun game that offers a nice creative outlet. You can not say that for many games.

[kitteninablender]

Nonsense. You're every bit as important as anybody else on this server.

Just cause I happen to know some people doesn't make me more important or more influential than anybody else. It just means I'm fortunate enough to have turned my passion into a career.

You're important. You matter. Never think otherwise.

<3

--- Kitten.

[Zanniej]

So much love!

I appreciate this topic a lot. I'm glad people are speaking their minds about stuff like this. Especially those that find constructive ways to do that, so thank you all!

Ofcourse Miasmata and I have got a vision of the direction of this server, which we will share with you before we begin the actual directing. However, at this moment we still have two great admins showing us the ropes, and teaching us how to be able to come close to being as awesome as they are (which I can only hope we will be able to do).

We will ensure that we share our vision with all of you, when our time to rule be admin has come. And in our vision we will surely take along the great feedback you all have given us. However, we do still need some time to iron out our vision. Added to that, we are still working hard on becoming the admins that you will (hopefully) love appreciate

Stepping in the giant footsteps of our current admins is no easy task, so please bear with us while we continue our training.

( An actual image of Miasmata and me, from behind the scenes:)

Hidden: show

[Steve]

Oh Z-man...you and the Mighty Miasmata are such teases!

What do we want? Direction!
When do we want it? NOW!

LOL. Christmas is also just around the corner, so....

[Zanniej]

I know right!

It would perhaps be a nice christmas present