Upcoming time of troubles

[Steve]

What you all should be more "worried" about is what happens after...the Era of Upheaval.

And of course, the dreaded 4e Rule Set!!!

[JustAnotherGuy]

This is kind of an aside ... but I don't know why people keep saying things like, "We need a shake up" and "nothing is causing change". There's been a LOT going on in the server lately. Perhaps nothing visual is changing, but attitudes, characters, ideals, circumstances, plots. All these things are shaking the world right now.


Now, back on topic, I do feel the ToT needs some representation. I do think that going too long with it would be detrimental. And I do feel that playing it out perfectly to lore would be detrimental. Again, I don't have any good ideas, just what I don't want to see! lol.

[Tanlaus]

This is kind of an aside ... but I don't know why people keep saying things like, "We need a shake up" and "nothing is causing change". There's been a LOT going on in the server lately. Perhaps nothing visual is changing, but attitudes, characters, ideals, circumstances, plots. All these things are shaking the world right now.


Now, back on topic, I do feel the ToT needs some representation. I do think that going too long with it would be detrimental. And I do feel that playing it out perfectly to lore would be detrimental. Again, I don't have any good ideas, just what I don't want to see! lol.

I agree. There’s quite a big thing going on with the new DM event lately. In fact I’d say there’s a noticeable uptick in DM activity that has been engaging a wide range of players. Things are being “shaken up” about to the extent they can be on a PW lately.

All credit to the DM team who, in my opinion are doing a great job breathing more life into the world.

[gedweyignasia]

I'm all for making magic fail for a year.

[zhazz]

While I can definitely see the benefits of a server wipe, and limiting PC levels to 20, I am also not a fan of it. Perhaps if the server had only consisted of the same unchanging groups of players for a few years. It hasn't, however, and there's a fair amount of "fresh blood" on the server. Myself included, although I am a returning player. For the sake of my own PC slots, and those of other players, I don't think a server wipe is a fair solution. It means that everything us "newer" players have been building towards would just disappear, or at the very least go unrewarded by virtue of no follow-up RP.

Resetting the economy is pretty much impossible to do, without doing a full server wipe. Every character would have to be modified to have very little gold, and no items in storage, on horses, or in their inventory. Only items worn would be kept. Which of course just means that everyone would make a million alts to wear said items.



I had a few hours of talk with artemitavik some months ago about this particular issue. While we both had different ideas and mindsets, the one thing we both agreed upon was having global Wild Magic in some form. Maybe 20% is too high a baseline. 6% might be more appropriate, and would yield a 6% to 15% spell failure for cantrips through 9th level respectively. Epic spells could maybe be fixed at 20%, I don't know.

It doesn't even need to be global. I fully imagine it is possible to have a weekly randomization of 10 or so areas that are affected. That alone should cause enough chaos, while also forcing people to go other places than their usual hunting grounds.



One thing I do agree with is not to ignore the ToT, nor to just skip over it. Whatever is done with it should be impactful, but not crippling.

[Kitunenotsume]

For my rather low investment of two cents:

The timeline on this PW has clearly diverged greatly from the WOTC canon, and should not be beholden to the same rules. By all rights, we're still technically based off the 2e lore set, plus most of two decades tweaking, adjustments, and independent tales. I do not see the ToT as a requirement by any degree. For that matter, the Tablets of Fate may not even exist in this cosmology, or are perfectly safe - no PC presumably has the ability to validate such divine scripture firsthand.

That said, were a Time-of-Troubles style event to occur, it certainly seems reasonably to run a month or two long rules adjustment, and perhaps make it more permanent. Level squishes are fine by me (I'm a proponent for E12), as are spell-failure (Personally I like failure% = spell-level squared: 1 = 1%, 4 = 16%, 9 = 81%).

I'm also aware that the server definitely has a lot going on recently, there are clearly politicking, events, and general meta-level activity, all of which are great - though I understand it is not constant, and certain time zones or antisocial archetypes would be clearly left out of the action.

All that said, if the ToT does happen, my main character would be recalled back to the East for the duration where they are unaffected by chaos in a foreign cosmology, so I really have not much skin in the game.

[Hoihe]

Well, the point isn't that the 12 years of the character would "never have happened" sort of thing, these characters would stay part of the lore of the server, clearly.

But this is a great opportunity to address a goodly portion of the balance, power creep, and lore/level issues that pop up on the server now and again. I don't think we should waste the clean slate potential.

And the year time skip was just an example, not a hard "WE MUST DO THIS" declaration or anything.

Using it to springboard a level 20 cap though, is in my mind totally legit "Well, magic don't work that way anymore... or godly powers.. huh... ok, new plan" sort of thing.

It would also encourage prestige classes to be more prestigious and such.

What's the difference of "never have happened" and "part of the lore" if you can't interact with either, sit down with in a tavern and share drinks with, go adventure together, perhaps pursue friendship, romance and rivalry - or change from one to another?



As for level caps - we must ensure PCs have access to 9th level spells. And potentially, epic spells (Epic Gate at least).

[artemitavik]

As for level caps - we must ensure PCs have access to 9th level spells. And potentially, epic spells (Epic Gate at least).

Why, exactly?

Also. the difference between "never have happened" and just advancing the timeline again is quite large. If it never happened, then it never happened. If it's just a new generation, yes, interaction with the now-npcs might be limited, but the history is still there, the legacy of what those organizations and people have done on the server is still there, still RPable about, and still have an impact on what future RP may be.

[Steve]

As far as I can tell, the dead magic and wild magic zones that are created during the Time of Troubles actually persist until 1369, even longer. So while the ToT officially is within a 10-months time in the year 1358DR, the after effects last many, many years (hence the Era of Upheaval).

My two cents is that BGTSCC is better served to use the year 1358 DR to diverge from the Canon timeline of the Forgotten Realms, and let the Players and the DMs carve out a new timeline, custom timeline. Why does this sound good to me? Because then, once and for all, we can end the meta knowledge of "how things should be..." in terms of Canon Timeline, and simple invest in storybuilding that reflects both the creativity and investment of the players, the DMs, the community that wish to actually write that story through unfolding RP that is "unhinged" from any pre-scripted chains.

I think the not knowing of the future, in terms of the BTSCC Sword Coast form 1358 DR onward, would be amazing, inspiring, exciting, challenging, etc. Things could change that we love/hate, and the game would be about how we players and DMs can role-play in the present of "all that mess."

I'm not saying lets throw the canon out with the bath water, but also consider that a World in which the future cannot be looked up on a Wiki, sounds rather...expansive and alluring, much more than "let's dot the I's and cross the T's, then move on."

[Rhifox]

My two cents is that BGTSCC is better served to use the year 1358 DR to diverge from the Canon timeline of the Forgotten Realms, and let the Players and the DMs carve out a new timeline, custom timeline. Why does this sound good to me? Because then, once and for all, we can end the meta knowledge of "how things should be..." in terms of Canon Timeline, and simple invest in storybuilding that reflects both the creativity and investment of the players, the DMs, the community that wish to actually write that story through unfolding RP that is "unhinged" from any pre-scripted chains.

I think the not knowing of the future, in terms of the BTSCC Sword Coast form 1358 DR onward, would be amazing, inspiring, exciting, challenging, etc. Things could change that we love/hate, and the game would be about how we players and DMs can role-play in the present of "all that mess."

I'm not saying lets throw the canon out with the bath water, but also consider that a World in which the future cannot be looked up on a Wiki, sounds rather...expansive and alluring, much more than "let's dot the I's and cross the T's, then move on."

This.

[artemitavik]

And thus does the discussion of Homebrew vs. Rules Lawyering take another turn.

That honestly may cost a fair number of players as well, depending on how many like to have the canon storyline represented. Don't know.

[Azroth]

Ok, so, if everyone wasn't annoyed with me enough for various things, I'm about to get myself likely shot.

My gun is clean and ready to go! j/k

All that aside, part of me would like to see us enter the era of upheaval. The other part of me worries about when we start to pass some of that and enter the 4e taint of retcons issued by WoTC rendering our current existence as is purely invalid.

The concerns of entering a new era such as the start of ToT are things like how the dynamic will change and wondering how well some will adapt such examples are... Bane's church split between Orthodox being the clerics then we have the Wizards branch off to a new view. Then gods die. We wait years for them to come back. The list goes on.

[Hoihe]

As for level caps - we must ensure PCs have access to 9th level spells. And potentially, epic spells (Epic Gate at least).

Why, exactly?

Also. the difference between "never have happened" and just advancing the timeline again is quite large. If it never happened, then it never happened. If it's just a new generation, yes, interaction with the now-npcs might be limited, but the history is still there, the legacy of what those organizations and people have done on the server is still there, still RPable about, and still have an impact on what future RP may be.

What's the point of a character if you can't interact with them?

I don't care about new characters played by the same player. I care about their current ones.

[artemitavik]

Because at that point, if there is a time jump, it's not a character anymore, it's history and storlyine/lore progression. As is, how likely is that anyway? Not very, so stress less.

You didn't answer my question about why.

[Hoihe]

Because at that point, if there is a time jump, it's not a character anymore, it's history. As is, how likely is that anyway? Not very, so stress less.

You didn't answer my question about why.

As for why 9th level:

True Resurrection, Gr. Restoration, Regenerate.