Loot Changes

[Steve]

RPing a dungeon would be easier if mob spawns worked on triggers, like passing certain corners or floorplates, etc., then just random everywhere. Or, at least, severely reduced to such. That way, pausing while moving through a dungeon or area, to interact via chat/emote, wouldn't feel pressured/rushed/impossible, by having mob spawns constantly interrupt the ongoing conversation.

We already have that on the trade way north of Beregost.
This map became one of the most annoying one, because there is always the same spawn group at the same place. No randomness at all

Also we have a lot of empty filler maps, which serve no point other than wasting the player's time traveling thru an empty map.

Maybe we should just put all the RP (and DM) maps on server1 and all the adventure/action maps on server 2.

I assume it is altogether possible to set triggers that, when passed or activated, cause mobs to be spawned both “in place” and randomly.

My original point was to reflect on how pausing to RP Chat in most Areas is constantly interrupted by mobs, and as well, often these mobs spawn at the periphery of the group, requiring one of the PCs to “run over there and slay the bugger.” Like, every few minutes.

I know that the current paradigm is circle grind an area, then park it at a rest spot, do some lite chat RP, then rinse repeat.

But who am I kidding? No one repeat adventures areas for RP. It’s all about loot gain, XP gain. And of course it is, because we’re only interested in our own stories, players and DMs alike. You gain little to nothing concrete in storybuilding anymore.

[MrSmith]

Maybe we should just put all the RP (and DM) maps on server1 and all the adventure/action maps on server 2.

Like a boss! Well said. No more debuffing when moving from one server to the other while adventuring. +10

Cheers!

[PaulImposteur]

I don't play here much anymore but maybe shifting to a new system, though what I suggest is probably complicated.

Since item hoarding is an issue, and gold honestly is just poop- perhaps moving towards a token system. Some sort of NPC where you can trade in Epics/items above a certain worth to get 1 token, it takes X tokens traded in order to purchase each Epic, corresponding with what seems fair. +3 and under still all on gold vendors, but Epics no longer available for gold.

Have a list that is always available Epics, and maybe a separate list that is Epics players traded in for their one token, that someone can buy for multiple. That way there's also a token sink in that fashion, since you can only earn one token but always costs multiple.

At this point without a wipe, people holding most of the Epics is going to happen no matter what but we can at least devalue gold since it is essentially going to continue to become more and more worthless. Also adding these tokens with a drop rate would also be nice, say starting level 12+ and can't be traded, that way new players can slowly save up for an Epic as they journey towards 30.

[RagingPeace]

I was wondering if the loot system is described anywhere on the forums or in the wiki? I don't mean down to the specification and implementation. Just a place to get a general idea of how it works, and what considerations you might make when forming an adventuring party.

This might be helpful for new and old players alike if it was easily accessible.

[Antras89]

And also remove the need for buffs to be viable.

Some builds are difficult to get RP done with in difficult dungeons as either they're just going to awkwardly sit in the corner, or blast thru their spell slots in 12 minutes while they're 60 minutes of dungeon left with nowhere to rest.

That's why I'm suprised here it's removed meta magic persistent spells.. What help with some short duration buffs

I don't think the reasoning behind it has been shared anywhere. At least it's not on the wiki. Though I can see why spells such as Haste, Divine Favor, Vigor, Death Armor, Body of the Sun, and Lesser Visage of the Deity would be considered a bit too powerful as 24 hour spells. Only way to really balance around them would be to allow +5 or greater weapons / equipment to exist. Which may indeed be the reason, as the server is limited to +4 items.

Well cannot agree 100%, at now you can put this spells in alot slots, so you can use them on "xp runs" with someone from one place to rest to antoher, but this kill alot rp beceuse "short time buffs", with persisnte spells you will be less worry of your spells buff time. Sure it give some power, but not so much in the end.

About loot and location, in most epic dungeons should be specific "epic chest" with very hight chance to spawn some rare or good epic loot.

[zhazz]

That's why I'm suprised here it's removed meta magic persistent spells.. What help with some short duration buffs

I don't think the reasoning behind it has been shared anywhere. At least it's not on the wiki. Though I can see why spells such as Haste, Divine Favor, Vigor, Death Armor, Body of the Sun, and Lesser Visage of the Deity would be considered a bit too powerful as 24 hour spells. Only way to really balance around them would be to allow +5 or greater weapons / equipment to exist. Which may indeed be the reason, as the server is limited to +4 items.

Well cannot agree 100%, at now you can put this spells in alot slots, so you can use them on "xp runs" with someone from one place to rest to antoher, but this kill alot rp beceuse "short time buffs", with persisnte spells you will be less worry of your spells buff time. Sure it give some power, but not so much in the end.

About loot and location, in most epic dungeons should be specific "epic chest" with very hight chance to spawn some rare or good epic loot.

That is what I mean. If short-duration spells were to be made persistent, then it will free up more spell slots. Granted it's quite limited how many rank 7 through 9 spell slots are available, which will limit how many persistent spells can be cast. Though typically it's two spells being recast over and over. Swapping 6+ rank 4 spells (extended rank 3s) for 2 rank 9 spells (persistant rank 3s) is adding a lot more flexibility, and thus power.

We're getting off-topic, however. Unless a discussion of the server philosophy in regards to caster power (no persistent spells) as a limiting factor to loot quality (no +5 items) is appropriate for a thread about Loot Changes. I think it is, but in the past threads have been locked for taking a detour to discuss an influencing aspect to the topic at hand. So I'll err on the side of caution, and suggest we go back to actual loot discussion, and leave server philosophies influencing loot for another thread.

[fedex]

what about put some NPC let's say bounty hunter, which reads your level\class etch, based upon that gives you a daily bounty quest for some boss and rewards you with a very good loot chest, while leaving the rest as it is?

[MrSmith]

…I want to see more characters dungeoneering across the server(aka: adventuring) …. Adventuring should be one of the more predominant activities on BG, all kinds of great roleplay gets generated by and spawns out of it, but it seems like it's paling in comparison to campfire gatherings filled with, IMHO, flat socialite roleplay.

For this, I think there are too many areas with too many mobs! Most dungeons give little to no time between the next spawn. And tactics for survival are moot besides building mechanics > mob stats.

This isn’t PnP Snarf-O!

To Steve's point, an aggressive spawn rate when moving through a dungeon can detract from the opportunity to dialogue and develop tactics. Yet, higher spawn rates are preferred when running racetracks (Wyverns, Trolls, and Reaching Forest). What works in one area may not apply to another.

I fear a constructive narrative on aggressive spawn rates when moving through a dungeon has to lead to a fundamental change on the server.

Revision: 900
Author: Valefort
Date: dimanche 6 février 2022 10:35:23
Message:
Reducing spawn rate in reaching woods.
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Modified : /sun_north, reaching woods.GIT

Revision: 899
Author: Valefort
Date: dimanche 6 février 2022 10:33:58
Message:
Reducing spawn rate in troll claw hills, troll cave.
----
Modified : /sun_troll claw hills, troll cave.GIT

The Wyverns, Troll Caves, and Reaching Woods are areas where higher spawn rates are preferred because these three areas are where characters go to level.

Did I miss it, or were other spawn rates also reduced?

Cheers!

[thepaganking]

Some points considering loot drops.

I do not understand what you mean by epic item hoarding? The loot that you pick up is randomly generated and everyone on this server has the same chance to gain an epic item as the other. Just because I find a +4 Katana with +3 vampiric regeneration does not mean you will not find one because it is in my inventory. You have the same chance to find that item or one that is better.

Furthermore, if I sell this item somewhere, there is no guarantee that you will get it before someone else purchases the item or that you will even be able to afford it - as it will probably be more expensive that many of the other epic items in the Baldur's gate store.

So please, stop indicating hoarding is somehow ruining the server or taking away from other players - if you want cool items, go out and get them, IMO, and don't complain that you cannot get epic items because you refuse to put in the time or energy to gain them.

TPK.

[zhazz]

Some points considering loot drops.

I do not understand what you mean by epic item hoarding? The loot that you pick up is randomly generated and everyone on this server has the same chance to gain an epic item as the other. Just because I find a +4 Katana with +3 vampiric regeneration does not mean you will not find one because it is in my inventory. You have the same chance to find that item or one that is better.

Furthermore, if I sell this item somewhere, there is no guarantee that you will get it before someone else purchases the item or that you will even be able to afford it - as it will probably be more expensive that many of the other epic items in the Baldur's gate store.

So please, stop indicating hoarding is somehow ruining the server or taking away from other players - if you want cool items, go out and get them, IMO, and don't complain that you cannot get epic items because you refuse to put in the time or energy to gain them.

TPK.

If 100 monkeys each sit in front of a typewriter, and hammer away at the keys randomly for 100 years, then one of them will eventually write on of Shakespere's works from start to finish, in one coherent long string of keystrokes.

Or so the saying goes.

Point is that even though there is a chance for something to happen, doesn't mean it will happen within a reasonable time frame. Maybe you get lucky and get that +4 EB +3 Vampiric Katana. And maybe the chance to get it is equal for everyone. But if it only happens, on a statistical average, once per 10 years, then it doesn't matter that the chance is equal for everyone. You found it first. By law of averages it's now another 10 years before someone finds one again.

If you decide to use, then fine. It's yours to use. You found it after all.

But if you decide not to, and just store it away, then you have, for all intents and purposes, reduced the statistical likelyhood from once in 10 years to once in 20 years. Meaning that anyone looking for just such an item have to wait that much longer before they can hopefully get it.

Maybe it is indeed priceless too, like a Vincent van Gogh painting. It's one-of-a-kind. But even those paintings will occasionally change hands, or be rented out. They don't just sit in a dusty storage container, never to be appreciated by anyone.

Of course, as the finder and owner of a one-of-a-kind item it is your prerogative to treat it as you see fit. This game being a social game, where community matters, however, does make me find such acts of noncooperation to be selfish.

If you won't sell it, or can't get a good enough price for it, then consider renting it out to someone you trust. Or even lending it to them. Have the item find some value and use in the game, beyond you just feeling awesome owning it.

That's just my opinion though. We probably won't ever see eye-to-eye on it. And that's fine. We're all different people. I prefer a more altruistic game. Others prefer a game where everyone pull themselves up by their own bootstraps.


As I've mentioned multiple times already, however, crafting will make away with all of that, if done properly. Gold is trackable means towards a goal, rather than relying on once-in-a-billion chance. If someone wants something unique that no one else has, then role play and/or DM events are the way to go.

[yyj]

Some points considering loot drops.

I do not understand what you mean by epic item hoarding? The loot that you pick up is randomly generated and everyone on this server has the same chance to gain an epic item as the other. Just because I find a +4 Katana with +3 vampiric regeneration does not mean you will not find one because it is in my inventory. You have the same chance to find that item or one that is better.

Furthermore, if I sell this item somewhere, there is no guarantee that you will get it before someone else purchases the item or that you will even be able to afford it - as it will probably be more expensive that many of the other epic items in the Baldur's gate store.

So please, stop indicating hoarding is somehow ruining the server or taking away from other players - if you want cool items, go out and get them, IMO, and don't complain that you cannot get epic items because you refuse to put in the time or energy to gain them.

TPK.

If 100 monkeys each sit in front of a typewriter, and hammer away at the keys randomly for 100 years, then one of them will eventually write on of Shakespere's works from start to finish, in one coherent long string of keystrokes.

Or so the saying goes.

Point is that even though there is a chance for something to happen, doesn't mean it will happen within a reasonable time frame. Maybe you get lucky and get that +4 EB +3 Vampiric Katana. And maybe the chance to get it is equal for everyone. But if it only happens, on a statistical average, once per 10 years, then it doesn't matter that the chance is equal for everyone. You found it first. By law of averages it's now another 10 years before someone finds one again.

If you decide to use, then fine. It's yours to use. You found it after all.

But if you decide not to, and just store it away, then you have, for all intents and purposes, reduced the statistical likelyhood from once in 10 years to once in 20 years. Meaning that anyone looking for just such an item have to wait that much longer before they can hopefully get it.

Maybe it is indeed priceless too, like a Vincent van Gogh painting. It's one-of-a-kind. But even those paintings will occasionally change hands, or be rented out. They don't just sit in a dusty storage container, never to be appreciated by anyone.

Of course, as the finder and owner of a one-of-a-kind item it is your prerogative to treat it as you see fit. This game being a social game, where community matters, however, does make me find such acts of noncooperation to be selfish.

If you won't sell it, or can't get a good enough price for it, then consider renting it out to someone you trust. Or even lending it to them. Have the item find some value and use in the game, beyond you just feeling awesome owning it.

That's just my opinion though. We probably won't ever see eye-to-eye on it. And that's fine. We're all different people. I prefer a more altruistic game. Others prefer a game where everyone pull themselves up by their own bootstraps.


As I've mentioned multiple times already, however, crafting will make away with all of that, if done properly. Gold is trackable means towards a goal, rather than relying on once-in-a-billion chance. If someone wants something unique that no one else has, then role play and/or DM events are the way to go.

Excuse me, but this is not how statistics work.

If you are really that in need for X or Y item, make a request to the DM team.

But players looting or playing the game have no bearing on your own personal statistics or loot, why? Because this is not a lottery. The number of loot generated is unlimited while in a lottery, someone else winning it does affect your chances of doing so because there is a limited number of tickets.

I do agree people should be more open to gift and give away items.

[Planehopper]

But if you decide not to, and just store it away, then you have, for all intents and purposes, reduced the statistical likelyhood from once in 10 years to once in 20 years.

That's not how that works at all.

[ficRlar]

this is useful information